VATSIM new audio codec? Any release date info, donation?

[Jack Colwill 815386]

Sweet. Well hopefully the latency issues can be improved and see what else can be improved after that. I think perhaps just knowing when to talk is key too. IRL, if I know the controller is busy, I'll keep my mouth shut and I know will contact me when I become priority.

[Ross Carlson]

Sweet. Well hopefully the latency issues can be improved and see what else can be improved after that. I think perhaps just knowing when to talk is key too. IRL, if I know the controller is busy, I'll keep my mouth shut and I know will contact me when I become priority.

 

Yeah, there are certainly plenty of people that don't seem to understand that a busy controller has more important things to do than acknowledge your check-in call when you are still 50 miles from the final.

[Robert Shearman Jr]

Here's an example of how we get people stepping on each other due to latency ... let's say we have a frequency with one controller and four pilots:

God, thanks for that, Ross. That was the explanation I was trying to come up with on my couch last night for Randy's benefit but kept getting mired in the different zigzagging of transmissions.

 

I'm on the bandwagon that the voice quality is not terrible here. It's the buffering that makes it so messy.

[Don Desfosse]

Tip of the hat, once again, Ross. That is THE BEST description of latency on VATSIM I've ever seen. And to anyone I've gotten snippy to for stepping on transmissions (it's happened once or twice or thrice), I apologize!

[Ross Carlson]

And to anyone I've gotten snippy to for stepping on transmissions (it's happened once or twice or thrice), I apologize!

 

I've even done it myself ... it just goes to show how frustrating the latency is.

[Andreas Fuchs]

Still, from my experience seasoned simmers are aware of this and try to be extra courteous before pushing the PTT-key. Please do not expect a new codec resolve those issues, because there are enough impatient/inconsiderate/inexperienced/stupid in the real world who start transmitting once they switched to a new frequency or do not wait for others to come back with their readbacks. I witness this behaviour every single day that I go to work!

 

Yes, a new codec will help, but it will not be the holy grail that will resolve all problems in this respect.

 

Btw. I do not have a lot of issues with voice on VATSIM. I have been using Squawkbox 2/3/4 for the past 15+ years (FS9...) and since April I am simming on a new machine with X-Plane 11 and xSquawkbox. No issues so far.

[Ross Carlson]

Yes, fixing the latency (again, it's not the codec ... it's the latency) will not suddenly make everyone employ proper radio etiquette. I don't think anyone is expecting that. (If they are, they are delusional.)

 

Fixing the latency will, however, help considerably with people UNWITTINGLY stepping on each other. And I would hazard a guess that in something like 80% of the cases where a user steps on another user, it is accidental.

 

And we're never going to eliminate latency completely, so we will never be able to fix the accidental stepping on of users, but there is a lot of latency built into the current system, so there is a lot of room for improvement.

[Andreas Fuchs]

Hey Ross,

 

codec/latency, for me it is all the same

 

I do think that the majority of users really thinks that an update in this area will fix it. They will be disappointed.

[Simon Kelsey]

An overhaul of the voice architecture will certainly help.

 

Latency is a big part of the issue, but so is quality to an extent. The current codec was designed in the days of dial up Internet where each user's bandwidth and quality of connection was a fraction of what it is now.

 

More modern codecs are a lot more efficient and capable of transmitting better quality audio at similar bandwidth with lower inherent latency (aside from any buffering going on in the clients).

 

From a quality point of view the current solution results in very 'mushy' audio (due to the primitive data compression) which is why many find it particularly hard to understand. Real world comms are very far from perfect but with modern radios are generally in my experience a lot more 'crisp' with far clearer top end, which makes them a lot more intelligible. The current VATSIM codec tends to lose a lot of the highs and muddy the lows, resulting in it all sounding a bit like bubbling mud. It's also incredibly unforgiving of slightly less than perfect audio setups, which in an organisation where there is going to be a huge variation in hardware is not really a great starting point.

 

Far better, as I have said before, to transmit the best quality audio possible and do any processing to make it sound more realistic on the client end as this gives much better control and clarity.

[Ross Carlson]

Well said, Simon ... that's a great description ... "bubbling mud".

[Clarke Kruger]

Couldn't agree more with Andreas and Ross. I'm also one of those that have not had problems with voice since I joined way back in 2002.

Common courtesy, proper setup, and patience seems to always work for me. oh did I mention proper setup???

[Andreas Fuchs]

In the real world I also come across controllers and pilots who almost unreadable, because their microphones are too far away from their mouths or because they have shi**y hardware. In that sense I find the current situation at VATSIM not toooooo unrealistic.

 

Don't get me wrong, I am all FOR a new voice codec etc.., but I don't see the urgency.

[Richard Asberg]

Moved to it's separate topic over here -> https://forums.vatsim.net/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=78339