Harry Sugden Posted August 20, 2018 at 10:45 AM Posted August 20, 2018 at 10:45 AM This isn't an issue on ES3.1, but it has been an issue on ES3.2 for as long as I've been using the .sline function on this version. Basically, the seconds on coordinates determined using the .sline tool are pretty much always off... RETSI N052.30.42.000 W002.52.33.000 Now if I zoom all the way in as far as possible on my EuroScope ASR, and use .sline exactly over the fix RETSI, I get... COORD:N052.30.42.000:W002.52.32.000 Now for another... MAY 117.900 N051.01.02.000 E000.06.58.000 ; Mayfield .sline produces... COORD:N051.01.01.000:E000.06.57.000 Infuriating!!!! Does anyone else have this problem? ATC Examiner, VATSIM UK No nonsense controlling Twitch - HazControl ✈️ @HVatsim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnus Meese Posted August 20, 2018 at 06:37 PM Posted August 20, 2018 at 06:37 PM .dcenter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Sugden Posted August 21, 2018 at 11:16 AM Author Posted August 21, 2018 at 11:16 AM .dcenter? Does what?? ATC Examiner, VATSIM UK No nonsense controlling Twitch - HazControl ✈️ @HVatsim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kieran Samuel Cross Posted August 21, 2018 at 12:28 PM Posted August 21, 2018 at 12:28 PM .dcenter? Does what?? Kind Regards, Kieran Cross, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonas Kuster Posted August 21, 2018 at 05:07 PM Posted August 21, 2018 at 05:07 PM Harry, did you round the decimals of the seconds yourself? Because I hardly get exactly 000 when I use sline. Jonas Kuster Network Supervisor Leader Operation vACC Switzerland | vacc.ch @vaccswitzerland GNG Support Team | gng.aero-nav.com ES Plugin Developer | CCAMS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Sugden Posted August 21, 2018 at 05:33 PM Author Posted August 21, 2018 at 05:33 PM Harry, did you round the decimals of the seconds yourself? Because I hardly get exactly 000 when I use sline. If you zoom in as far as possible (until you can’t zoom anymore!), and .sline over a point in the sector file that’s .000 ATC Examiner, VATSIM UK No nonsense controlling Twitch - HazControl ✈️ @HVatsim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Sugden Posted August 21, 2018 at 05:34 PM Author Posted August 21, 2018 at 05:34 PM Cheers, I’ll try this out! (and haha yes I could have just looked up what it did, but thanks) ATC Examiner, VATSIM UK No nonsense controlling Twitch - HazControl ✈️ @HVatsim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Sugden Posted August 21, 2018 at 10:20 PM Author Posted August 21, 2018 at 10:20 PM Still getting the same .sline results despite changing the .dcenter to somewhere closer... ATC Examiner, VATSIM UK No nonsense controlling Twitch - HazControl ✈️ @HVatsim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonas Kuster Posted August 23, 2018 at 07:29 AM Posted August 23, 2018 at 07:29 AM Harry, what file did you take for reference for the coordinates? Jonas Kuster Network Supervisor Leader Operation vACC Switzerland | vacc.ch @vaccswitzerland GNG Support Team | gng.aero-nav.com ES Plugin Developer | CCAMS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Sugden Posted August 23, 2018 at 01:33 PM Author Posted August 23, 2018 at 01:33 PM Harry, what file did you take for reference for the coordinates? Well, fixes and other navaids all come from the NATS AIP ENR docomeents - but that's besides the point really, since I've been involved with the sector file for over 4 years now and I'm sure it's not an issue with any of the data. What would be helpful is if someone else could zoom all the way in on a known fix that they have the coordinates for, use .sline, and check whether they have the same issue described in my original post? That might be able to help me establish whether it's a EuroScope problem or a Sector File/.dcenter issue... Thanks ATC Examiner, VATSIM UK No nonsense controlling Twitch - HazControl ✈️ @HVatsim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonas Kuster Posted August 24, 2018 at 08:52 AM Posted August 24, 2018 at 08:52 AM [Mod - Happy Thoughts]uming you are talking about the UK sector file, I just found out that the package - at least the one which is available for me through ES download - contains only ese/sct file. So the source will be the sct file. For other advanced sector file packages, it also could be the isec file. So I checked the fixes you mentioned and got: for RETSI: COORD:N052.30.41.000:W002.52.33.000 for MAY: COORD:N051.01.02.000:E000.06.58.000 But I have to admit also that the zoom factor seems not detailed enough to precisely click on the spot. If I click slightly west or south, I can see that initially the seconds are reduced by one and only when going farer away, also the seconds decimal change from 000 to 999 and so on. Seems to be a rounding problem or at least an inconsistency between the seconds and the decimals. Jonas Kuster Network Supervisor Leader Operation vACC Switzerland | vacc.ch @vaccswitzerland GNG Support Team | gng.aero-nav.com ES Plugin Developer | CCAMS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Sugden Posted August 24, 2018 at 09:01 AM Author Posted August 24, 2018 at 09:01 AM I get what you’re saying but it isn’t an issue using ES3.1 - get the exact coordinate as defined in the sector file every time... Thanks for having a look - as long as it’s not just me then I guess I will have to keep correcting coordinates a little for the time being! ATC Examiner, VATSIM UK No nonsense controlling Twitch - HazControl ✈️ @HVatsim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonas Kuster Posted August 25, 2018 at 09:50 AM Posted August 25, 2018 at 09:50 AM I still wonder what for you need the sline command in connection with waypoints. Maybe you can explain the use case. I think there are easier solutions than how you do it. Jonas Kuster Network Supervisor Leader Operation vACC Switzerland | vacc.ch @vaccswitzerland GNG Support Team | gng.aero-nav.com ES Plugin Developer | CCAMS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Sugden Posted August 25, 2018 at 10:19 AM Author Posted August 25, 2018 at 10:19 AM The use of .sline with waypoints is simply to demonstrate the issue The UK has a lot of CTAs being established at the moment which replace airspace previously encomp[Mod - Happy Thoughts]ed by airways - when this happens, I need to use .sline to determine which of our old ‘AIRWAYS’ lines in Geo to remove since they were never labelled back in the day. Another use - some of our sector lines (we have a huge amount considering both Scottish and London sectors!) are named in ways that don’t help identify them, so again .sline helps when trying to edit/adjust things. Anyway, finding an alternative way to do something doesn’t solve the issue that’s occurring which is obviously something to do with EuroScope. So this thread is more of a way of pointing out that there is an issue to fix! ATC Examiner, VATSIM UK No nonsense controlling Twitch - HazControl ✈️ @HVatsim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonas Kuster Posted August 26, 2018 at 08:38 AM Posted August 26, 2018 at 08:38 AM This tool might help you to get parts of your sct file analyzed visually quicker. The advantage is, that you can read the coordinates directly when hovering the points. https://webtools.kusternet.ch/coordinatesimporter Also consider using GNG in the future. It includes f.e. an updated airway structure according the current AIRAC and sector lines (also those to be displayed between active ATC) are calculated automatically once you provide a set of points and sector definitions with those points. I'm using this to create sector file for the EuroCenter vACC. So I'm aware of the number of airspaces in Europe. And in my opinion, GNG is the only tool that allows the amount of work required for complex sector files to be done within a reasonable time. Jonas Kuster Network Supervisor Leader Operation vACC Switzerland | vacc.ch @vaccswitzerland GNG Support Team | gng.aero-nav.com ES Plugin Developer | CCAMS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Sugden Posted August 26, 2018 at 08:57 AM Author Posted August 26, 2018 at 08:57 AM This tool might help you to get parts of your sct file analyzed visually quicker. The advantage is, that you can read the coordinates directly when hovering the points.https://webtools.kusternet.ch/coordinatesimporter Also consider using GNG in the future. It includes f.e. an updated airway structure according the current AIRAC and sector lines (also those to be displayed between active ATC) are calculated automatically once you provide a set of points and sector definitions with those points. I'm using this to create sector file for the EuroCenter vACC. So I'm aware of the number of airspaces in Europe. And in my opinion, GNG is the only tool that allows the amount of work required for complex sector files to be done within a reasonable time. Ah cheers - that tool might be quite useful! Regarding GNG, when I was Operations Manager I decided that continuing to maintain the sector file wholly by ourselves was more appropriate at the time, though I don't make the decisions anymore! I think for now our GitHub solution is working quite well. ATC Examiner, VATSIM UK No nonsense controlling Twitch - HazControl ✈️ @HVatsim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonas Kuster Posted August 26, 2018 at 12:23 PM Posted August 26, 2018 at 12:23 PM I think for now our GitHub solution is working quite well.Yeah, I know. But just for yourself (your own vACC). For any updates affecting data of neighbour vACCs, this needs a lot of work of two people (one from each vACC). Considering this scenario, GNG has unrivalled advantages over any existing systems. Depends where your focus is ... Jonas Kuster Network Supervisor Leader Operation vACC Switzerland | vacc.ch @vaccswitzerland GNG Support Team | gng.aero-nav.com ES Plugin Developer | CCAMS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Sugden Posted August 26, 2018 at 12:25 PM Author Posted August 26, 2018 at 12:25 PM Yeah, I know. But just for yourself (your own vACC). For any updates affecting data of neighbour vACCs, this needs a lot of work of two people (one from each vACC). Considering this scenario, GNG has unrivalled advantages over any existing systems. Depends where your focus is ... I'll point the Operations Director to GNG, and suggest that the sectors and sector lines are updated (and coordinated with adjacent vACCs!) ATC Examiner, VATSIM UK No nonsense controlling Twitch - HazControl ✈️ @HVatsim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts