When Controllers Just Log On...

[Kirk Christie]

Based on the process you have described, and I dont know any one else that has such an unnecessary complicated process, you would actually be failing to meet the code of conduct requirements, where by you must monitor for ATC at all times. You will have to go through this process no matter what stages of flight you are in when ever any controller sends you a contact me.

I dont think you can blame VATSIM ATC for trying to do their job because of your overly complicated set up.

For context I regularly fly in a full scale fixed based 737 simulator with multiple levels of software running the sim, and we can see our vatsim client and respond in a timely fashion.

[Torben Andersen]

16 hours ago, Ryan Renz said:

I fear everyone's mistaken my comment...

I'm not saying I don't want to communicate with ATC; on the contrary, I just would prefer the use of a radio (explicitly).  Maybe in everyone's setup they are fit for texting, I am not; I have setup my system (work in progress... to the best of my ability) to emulate a real airplane cockpit.  Pilots do not fly with keyboards on their lap.

 

That's all I'm intending to convey.  Sorry if my input is worthless, but why the heck are we even using radios in the first place if we're not intending to be as real as we can get.

 

I mean we have strict guidelines about non Military a/c landing or flying places (that says not game like to me vs reality-simulation).  But then that line of emulation is bent when we say "Well we could create a solution, everything is possible in this day and age with computers... but we actually PREFER, to make this more cumbersome for users and force them to use a mouse and keyboard".

 

In order for me to see and interact with a text message the steps I must follow are:

turn on wireless keyboard

press the alt key

select modules -> fsuipc

press the windows key

(meanwhile my airplane is a ghost flying by itself on a live server)

get mouse in hand

turn on mouse

click on Swift

navigate to appropriate menu (for some reason - I must be the only one - the swift menus do not fit on any of my screens; it is FAR too large, it literally spans all of my monitors (independent screens, not spanned or cloned), in which I have to view separate parts of the window on different monitors like looking through a piece of Swiss Cheese peeking at a piece of world class art hidden behind a wall with holes in it.)

read the text

click on fs

click on fs main window

press esc

click on continue flying

exit fsuipc

AND hope my system didn't crash.

Then tune my radios and contact - all while flying an airplane - (which isn't super easy)

 

or

 

Like I'm suggesting:

radio announcement heard, frequency and atc callsign understood

tune radio

call atc

 

All I'm saying is two steps is simpler than, more than two steps.  Plus it's (imo) closer to the real deal, which is why I am here to begin with.

 

Sorry if I'm out of line.  I just don't understand why no one agrees with my logic here.  But to each their own, and you are just as much entitled to your opinions and preferences.

 

I'll keep my mouth shut from here.

 

Sometimes small implementations do the trick. I use a chill mini keyboard in my cockpit. 

[Tobias Dammers]

You have to have access to your pilot client, simply because there is no feasible alternative. Granted, this isn't realistic, but it's the only way we can deal with the fact that, unlike IRL, ATC is available whenever a volunteer feels like providing service.

How exactly you do it is up to you, but you do need a way of interacting with the pilot client. Depending on what you use, this could involve:

• Running the pilot client on a separate monitor (most of us, I believe, use multi-monitor setups, so you can have the sim on your main screen, and the pilot client on an off-hand screen)
• Running the pilot client on a separate computer (this, to me, seems like the best compromise for a full-scale simulator: you can just place a tablet or laptop somewhere convenient and use that to control your pilot client)
• Forwarding text messages to your sim, and responding on voice (this should allow you to respond to contact-me's at least)
• Integrating VATSIM text messages with the in-sim (M)CDU, effectively treating it as a datalink

Specifically, you don't need to write text messages yourself, just being able to read them will cover 99% of use cases, at least if you've filed /V/.

[Tomas Hansson]

To quote VATSIM Code of Conduct A14:

Quote

A14 - Voice is the preferred method of communication on VATSIM, though all members shall accommodate, with the same level of service, those communicating only by text. ...

There may be the rare occasion when you will encounter ATC that for various reasons cannot use voice. (We do have deaf Controllers on the network.) At this time, a per the CoC, you are required to communicate using text!

Edited April 4, 2022 at 12:58 PM by Tomas Hansson

[Ryan Renz]

I certainly do adhere to the COC, as reminded various times.  And also understand the need for texting at times.  As stated, it's not that I 'do not do these things', I realize I'm flying a computer online, just that I would PREFER to have an alternative method.  Sometimes the text comes up on my instrument display and it's easy to read and then switch to the frequency, other times it comes up on my projector and I have no hope in reading that tiny text.  Kind of like I would prefer to have a motion simulator, force feedback, or 6 million dollars... these are all better things that I work "towards" getting, even if only in concept.  I can never agree that having $20 is better than $6m, just like I can never agree texting is better than talking. 

 

Gosh, I feel like the first person to ever envision flight as a better method for travel and every other person in the world says it's ludacris.  Sorry for thinking things could be better; I guess it's perfect just the way things are and we never need to change or assess them. 

 

Where's the coolaid?! 😅

 

P.S. (It's okay, I'm used to being the sole isolate with my own opinion that differs from every single one; I still stand by my opinion, things could be better and more realistic - as for disabilities, deaf people have been able to use telephones for decades.  If vatsim doesn't want me I can just move on and fly offline by myself and talk to no one.)

 

P.P.S. And I certainly AM NOT pointing fingers at anyone or discriminating against anyone.

 

Sometimes you bend around the spoon, and others the spoon bends around you... I think there should be no bending at all; everything should just be perfect (but that's just life), but we shouldn't just stop and not move towards an 'unobtainable' goal. 

[Ross Carlson]

31 minutes ago, Ryan Renz said:

Sorry for thinking things could be better

I guess it's perfect just the way things are

we never need to change or assess them. 

If vatsim doesn't want me I can just move on and fly offline by myself and talk to no one.

You described the arduous process you have to go through just to read a text message, alternatives were suggested, and this is where you land. Really?

[Tobias Dammers]

22 hours ago, Ryan Renz said:

Gosh, I feel like the first person to ever envision flight as a better method for travel and every other person in the world says it's ludacris.  Sorry for thinking things could be better; I guess it's perfect just the way things are and we never need to change or assess them. 

Nobody is arguing that things couldn't be better than the process you're describing.

People are just telling you that we don't need to change the rules to make things better than that.

I have given you four suggestions that you can look into you to improve your situation, and none of them requires changing anything on the VATSIM side.

Nobody is arguing that the current situation is perfect, either.

Just that any change that would make things better for you would likely make things worse for somebody else.