XX03 FIR

[Bailey Brown]

Hey All,

 

I was looking through Navigraph today and stumbled across the XX03 FIR. (Image of it here: https://prnt.sc/lu88b9)

 

In real life who would these controllers hand aircraft off too?

[Markus Vitzethum]

Hi Bailey,

 

I have no real world clue. But

 

- around 2000 I talked a lot to a friend from Argentina (a dispatcher that that time, now pilot) about the flights on the Buenos Aires to Sydney route, which were pioneered by Aerolineas Argentinas in the late 1990s or so. According to him - I still have copies of the enroute charts - the area between New Zealand and South America South of, say S55 or S60, was "No FIR" as well. (Expect the New Zealand - McMurdo airway). He confirmed that in fact the B747-200 used at the time were not talking to ATC in that area. In fact, apparently for some time, the Argentinian Air Force used some airborne C-130 aircraft as HF communications relay to keep in touch with the commercial flight.

 

- I understand that hardly any airplane ever flies in this "No FIR" area between Galapagos and Tahiti. There are absolutely no commercial air routes in this airspace, to my very best knowledge. All pacific traffic either flies to California/Canada, goes via Tahiti and Easter Island to Chile, or connects Australia/New Zealand to Santiago de Chile or Buenos Aires via a South Pacific route (sometimes near the Antarctic coast line).

 

The only flight I am aware of was a one-time Cargolux flight from Avalon ( near Melbourne) to Latacunga, Ecuador.

It's docomeented here:

https://de.flightaware.com/live/flight/CLX853/history/20160218/1040Z/YMAV/SELT

 

Most likely this was a positioning flight after a moto grand prix chart inbound Melbourne to its next flower cargo loading from Ecuador back to Europe (full route here: http://aerowinx.com/board/index.php?topic=3445.msg35260#msg35260 )

 

But even this flight barely enters the "No FIR" region near its South-East corner for just a few track miles.

 

Hope this helps,

Markus

[Sebastien Bartosz]

https://ops.group/blog/tag/clipperton-fir/

 

 

http://dca.clipperton-gov.co/

[Pierre Ferran]

https://ops.group/blog/tag/clipperton-fir/

 

 

http://dca.clipperton-gov.co/

 

Are you sure this is legit? There is no Clipperton Government, as the island is under direct control of the French Ministry of Overseas department. Moreover, the island has been uninhabited since 1945 but the website lists the address of "DCA H.Q Building, Clipperton International Airport, Clipperton 11021, Clipperton" (there is no Clipperton International Airport). If you go to any non existent page of the site, you'll see it redirects to opsfox.net, which again, does not seem very legit.

 

I couldn't find any information on the websites of the French DGAC, Government, or the Government of French Polynesia, doesn't seem much more than a joke to me, also considering the article was posted on April 1st.

[Sebastien Bartosz]

Maybe Pierre ! You might be right

After all it was very late!

It just seems like that’s a lot of work for just an April 1st joke

[Bailey Brown]

Thanks everyone on the info provided its really interesting to read through

[Tim Barber]

https://www.icao.int/SAM/Documents/2019-SCM1/SCM_1 Summary of Discussions.pdf