New Pilots Rating and ATOs Question

[Benjamin Rodriguez]

Hi.

I have already seen that the new driver ranking system has become active.
Pilots with P5 has been degraded to P2.
It was commented that if the P5 do it with multi-engine, it could be in P3 depending on the ATO.
I have consulted with VATSUR, the ATO where I had taken everything out and they comment that they will not go to P3 even if the P5 has been made with multi-engine.
I am also in the VACC of Spain, and the VATSUR ATO tells me that I should change the VACC to be able to access training again.
My question is whether an ATO can force a VACC change ???
What can I do if I am doing ATC courses in Spain and I also want to take the pilot courses?
I can't do it because the ATO requires me to change VACC?
And if you say that I was looking for another ATO, the problem is that VATSUR is the only one that gave the training in Spanish.

Thank you very much.

[Mats Edvin Aaro]

Nobody can force you to change a vACC. Some vACC's are also ATO's, but it should be a very distinct line. I will notify someone from the ATO leadership to take a look at this. 🙂

[Benjamin Rodriguez]

9 minutes ago, Mats Edvin Aaro said:

Nobody can force you to change a vACC. Some vACC's are also ATO's, but it should be a very distinct line. I will notify someone from the ATO leadership to take a look at this. 🙂

VATSUR ATO do it 😉 

Is what they answered to me (Juan Ferreira 967943 )

 

[Ethan Hawes]

Hello Ben,

Per the member news release a month or so ago, you are correct that ATOs that utilize multi engine aircraft could have had their P5s transitioned to a P3 if they went through the channels they were informed of independently. Basically we had to see all of the new P3’s multi engine criteria be met to allow the ATO to have their members transfer differently than the rest which was not the case for a majority.
 

Many ATOs likely did not teach or examine engine out procedures which is a new and important element that is now included in the P3 and P4 Member Certification Standards.  
 

You do not have to be a controller in a vACC to utilize their training department. See the ATOs new member signup instructions for more details. As of now we have about 4 ATOs online with 5-8 more in the approval process to operate under the new system in the coming week or so. 
 

Ethan

[Benjamin Rodriguez]

Thanks Ethan,

But the question is if ATO may force to change from VACC to pilot training.

Thanks.

[Ethan Hawes]

Force you to change to their vACC? No 

[Mats Edvin Aaro]

5 hours ago, Benjamin Rodriguez said:

But the question is if ATO may force to change from VACC to pilot training.

As Ethan says, they have no right to do so. A vACC is a locally regulated sector for controllers, they have no affiliation to pilot ratings. However some facilities have made an ATO using the vACC name to make a facility both providing ATC and pilot training, but it's important to note that these to remain separate.

What I personally think has happened here, without having looked into it is that someone, somewhere has forgotten or misunderstood the concept of an ATO, or has gotten confused with the difference in the vACC and the ATO. 

An ATO is not allowed to restrict their services to only give pilot training to members in the vACC. If someone claims so, you can refer them to either this forum thread, or to email Ethan (Vice President Pilot Training) at [email protected]. 

Good luck on your pilot training! 🙂

[Benjamin Rodriguez]

Is into spain but it is te response of VATSUR.

[Benjamin Rodriguez]

[Ethan Hawes]

Benjamin,

Unrestricted and membership based ATOs have always been a thing, but as it says in the ATO Policies and Procedures Handbook section 2.3.2 ,only VAs and VSOs historically have been membership only training organizations. The Pilot Training Department has realized that we have not publicly made each ATO establish if they are and unrestricted or membership based ATO yet. 

In light of this short coming we are updating all active ATO's enrollment types over the next week and making sure that ATOs publicly list their Unrestricted or Membership type of enrollment in their operations manual and on on the VATSIM ATO Roster. Sorry for the confusion and thank you for presenting this issue to our team. We anticipate on a couple more Spanish based ATOs being approved in the coming weeks as they are finishing up their approval process as we speak. It is also worth mentioning that no pilot training is ongoing at this time as we are having a small technical difficulty that required a work around to get the new rating system to work. We anticipate on this issue being fixed in the coming week.

Ethan

[Benjamin Rodriguez]

Thanks for info Ethan 

I will be aware !