VFR Weather

[Tomas Chrapek]

Hello guys! I wanted to ask what (if any) is the general rule for all ATC controllers on Vatsim. Do they have any right to refuse VFR clearance just for the real-time weather (if METAR indicates VFR is not possible in real life)? I mean anyone can set up their sim whatever they want and I remember reading somewhere that ATC will NOT deny me VFR because of the weather for that very reason.

I came into that situation with one of the controllers - he apologized, said he does not agree with this, but that the orders from above in his region are that they need to refuse VFR if real world weather does not permit the VFR flight. I personally believe it goes against Vatsim general policy. Your thoughts?

Edit: I realized this was probably not a correct location to post this. Feel free to move it where it belongs. Thank you.

Edited November 11, 2021 at 10:17 AM by Tomas Chrapek
wrong forum location

[Tobias Dammers]

Not sure about the actual rules; the Code of Conduct at least does not say anything on the matter specifically. However:

• It is very common for VFR pilots on VATSIM to configure their simulator for VMC. You need to still have the real-world QNH and winds configured, so that your aircraft behaves as expected when assigned headings and altitudes, and so that the runways you operate on have the same conditions for you as they do for everyone else, but you can set your daylight and visibility however you like. If you deviate from real-world visibility conditions, it is customary to leave a remark about it in your flightplan (e.g. "CAVOK" and/or "DAYLIGHT").
• If you don't have any such remarks in your flight plan, ATC may choose to simulate real weather, and provide realistic service, which is great - but if you then explain that your sim is configured for VMC, then they should allow the flight. Disallowing a flight entirely is something ATC cannot do on a whim, and most will simply assume that weather conditions on your end are in line with what you request.
• An exception may be when the airport is doing low-viz ops (CAT-II/III). In such a situation, working VFR into the flow would be an unreasonable demand, and break everyone else's immersion. After all, when both IFR and VFR traffic operate in the same airspace, visual separation is often necessary, or at least a useful tool - but imagine flying a CAT-III approach into dense fog, and being asked to report a Cessna on your 1-o'clock in sight.

The reason for this is that most of us can only fly at specific times, usually in the local evenings, and especially during the winter months, this would give us little or no opportunity to fly VFR.

If in doubt, .wallop.

[Andreas Fuchs]

Quote

I came into that situation with one of the controllers - he apologized, said he does not agree with this, but that the orders from above in his region are that they need to refuse VFR if real world weather does not permit the VFR flight. I personally believe it goes against Vatsim general policy. Your thoughts?

It is against the spirit of VATSIM. You may want to bring this topic up with your VACC staff, otherwise ask divisional staff to issue respective instructions to that VACC.

 

 

[Robert Shearman Jr]

There's no requirement to fly with real-world weather active.  There are some etiquette-related considerations, as pointed out above -- and as always, if you want to do something that's contrary to the flow of traffic, the answer from the controller should be less like "no" and more like "yes but expect a significant delay."  That's my take on it, anyway.

[Tomas Chrapek]

20 hours ago, Tobias Dammers said:

Not sure about the actual rules; the Code of Conduct at least does not say anything on the matter specifically. However:

• It is very common for VFR pilots on VATSIM to configure their simulator for VMC. You need to still have the real-world QNH and winds configured, so that your aircraft behaves as expected when assigned headings and altitudes, and so that the runways you operate on have the same conditions for you as they do for everyone else, but you can set your daylight and visibility however you like. If you deviate from real-world visibility conditions, it is customary to leave a remark about it in your flightplan (e.g. "CAVOK" and/or "DAYLIGHT").
• If you don't have any such remarks in your flight plan, ATC may choose to simulate real weather, and provide realistic service, which is great - but if you then explain that your sim is configured for VMC, then they should allow the flight. Disallowing a flight entirely is something ATC cannot do on a whim, and most will simply assume that weather conditions on your end are in line with what you request.
• An exception may be when the airport is doing low-viz ops (CAT-II/III). In such a situation, working VFR into the flow would be an unreasonable demand, and break everyone else's immersion. After all, when both IFR and VFR traffic operate in the same airspace, visual separation is often necessary, or at least a useful tool - but imagine flying a CAT-III approach into dense fog, and being asked to report a Cessna on your 1-o'clock in sight.

The reason for this is that most of us can only fly at specific times, usually in the local evenings, and especially during the winter months, this would give us little or no opportunity to fly VFR.

If in doubt, .wallop.

Of course I would not complain if the flow of other traffic was really busy. However, that particular airport had in that time virtually no traffic. I was listening on the tower frequency (which was the only active one at the time) and there was like two IFR departures in 30 minutes and no arrival at all. So it was purely the matter of weather in that case. Naturally, I would configure my QNH and wind to be complacent with the real world weather in order not to cause any flow problems.

17 hours ago, Andreas Fuchs said:

It is against the spirit of VATSIM. You may want to bring this topic up with your VACC staff, otherwise ask divisional staff to issue respective instructions to that VACC.

 

 

I will try to find the correct place to post this.

Thank you all for replying to me.