Ratings are difficult to get

[Benjamin Koula]

I'm not new to aviation or airplanes and I know what I'm doing on the network, but I still look new because of my P0 rating and OBS rating. I have a student pilots license IRL but that isn't applicable to VATSIM, but I think that it should. ATO's should be able to offer programs for real-world student pilots to get ratings easier than some 13 year old that flies just to screw around.

[Emir Dhil-Maanli]

29 minutes ago, Benjamin Koula said:

I'm not new to aviation or airplanes and I know what I'm doing on the network, but I still look new because of my P0 rating and OBS rating. I have a student pilots license IRL but that isn't applicable to VATSIM, but I think that it should. ATO's should be able to offer programs for real-world student pilots to get ratings easier than some 13 year old that flies just to screw around.

Honestly, the rating changes absolutely nothing at all to what is done, no one looks "new" because of the P0 rating. People here got 5000hrs and more with the P0, you can have a P0 rating and have a excellent level. It means nothing.

[Alistair Thomson]

4 hours ago, Benjamin Koula said:

VATSIM

 

4 hours ago, Benjamin Koula said:

I have a student pilots license IRL but that isn't applicable to VATSIM

That's correct. VATSIM emulates the real world and a student licence isn't a PPL. Many real world pilots on VATSIM don't go for the equivalent VATSIM rating, myself included, because it confers no status beyond perceived kudos and we don't feel the need for that, having proved our skills in the real world. 

However, there are real benefits to gaining VATSIM ratings: you learn a lot and become a better pilot online when you gain ratings.

[Mackenzie Kraus]

On 5/23/2022 at 10:09 AM, Benjamin Koula said:

I'm not new to aviation or airplanes and I know what I'm doing on the network, but I still look new because of my P0 rating and OBS rating. I have a student pilots license IRL but that isn't applicable to VATSIM, but I think that it should. ATO's should be able to offer programs for real-world student pilots to get ratings easier than some 13 year old that flies just to screw around.

I'm pretty sure they give student pilot certificates away for free to anyone that wants one?

[Sebastien Bartosz]

1 hour ago, Mackenzie Kraus said:

I'm pretty sure they give student pilot certificates away for free to anyone that wants one?

Irrelevant, deconstructive and useless comment. Anything else you want to add?

[Mike Teague]

On 5/23/2022 at 8:09 AM, Benjamin Koula said:

but I still look new because of my P0 rating

ive been on vatsim since before it was even formed (satco days) and have a P0

i dont feel like proving i know rudimentary basics considering i also have  C3 

 

 

Edited June 11, 2022 at 11:08 AM by Mike Teague

[Richard McDonald Woods]

I have been using VATSIM since its very early days. I am only S0 and P2 but with 6000+ hrs flying.

I certainly feel that we have consistently shied away from an achievable pilot training and rating process.

I have long had an interest in developing pilot training courses but have found a resistance from many quarters to actual practical progress. I now feel too old to contribute further.

It would be so much better if we had to climb a pilot qualifications ladder. This would have to be both ground school and practical flying training based on real-world processes. Although it may sound harsh, I would hope that a student pilot couldn't use VATSIM online until appropriately qualified

Until then I shall just continue to fly online when my B77F and GFO becomes available.✈️

Edited June 11, 2022 at 12:57 PM by Richard McDonald Woods

[Andrew Crowley]

On 6/3/2022 at 7:07 PM, Sebastien Bartosz said:

Irrelevant, deconstructive and useless comment. Anything else you want to add?

Well except for the fact that he's correct. You simply apply for a student pilot's license and you receive it.  There is no knowledge test or checkride associated with the student license...

As far as Vatsim goes, I don't even understand why there are pilot ratings. I bet, though, that just like in real life, the ratings you hold don't mean much to anyone else in the system... you're instead judged by your performance.  Despite having an ATP, several types, and thousands of hours in reality, I imagine I'm still a P0 on Vatsim or whatever is lower... I've never even looked. But I've also never had a controller treat me as anything but an experienced pilot, probably because when I contact them I sound like I've done it a million times before. 

Ratings aren't worth anything; ability is.  One doesn't confer the other ;).

[Alistair Thomson]

4 hours ago, Andrew Crowley said:

Ratings aren't worth anything

True, and I wholeheartedly agree with your view that, like me, a rw qualified pilot with ratings up to the armpits can be quite comfortable on VATSIM with a P0. But while VATSIM ratings confer no privileges, it's surely the learning process required to acquire these ratings which is worth a lot, and which I think must improve the flying ability of the candidate who has no rw equivalents?

[Andrew Crowley]

Oh highly agree there, yes. A good training program is good for everyone involved!  My comment was more aimed at the idea you sometimes see these days that chasing some sort of rating or achievement is important in its own right. I was just saying that I think the knowledge and experience are what's valuable, not the rating itself.  I guess I don't see a reason to explore granting vatsim ratings based on real-world experience.

[Alistair Thomson]

+ 1. But we must accept that some folks just like gongs! 🙂

[Simon Kelsey]

20 hours ago, Andrew Crowley said:

Oh highly agree there, yes. A good training program is good for everyone involved!  My comment was more aimed at the idea you sometimes see these days that chasing some sort of rating or achievement is important in its own right. I was just saying that I think the knowledge and experience are what's valuable, not the rating itself.  I guess I don't see a reason to explore granting vatsim ratings based on real-world experience.

To be clear, we already (and have for some time) provide the facility for qualified (operative word!) pilots to have their licence recognised within VATSIM if they so wish: https://my.vatsim.net/pilots/train/upload. The main practical utility of doing so is that holding the relevant VATSIM rating allows such members to train others up to that level, for example, though obviously there are also many who do so simply to have it "on their profile" so to speak.

As to why the pilot rating system exists -- as Alistair says, achieving a rating is a mark of recognition for those who have taken the time to further their learning and understanding, and provides a basic global standard for the ratings. If obtaining and being able to 'show off' the badge encourages more people to seek out and take advantage of said training who otherwise wouldn't have, then that is a good thing! Motivation comes in many forms - for some it may be primarily the quest for new knowledge or skills that drives them to learn more, for others it may be the desire to prove to themselves that they are able to meet a particular standard, for others it may be the desire to impress their peers by showing off a rating (and for yet others it may start that way and end up more like the first) - for many it may be some combination of all the above. Either way, if we are all agreed that greater levels of participation in quality training programmes is a good thing for both individuals and VATSIM as a whole, providing as many possible avenues to motivate people to get involved is a good thing, right? 🙂 

Simon

[Andrew Crowley]

Fair points!