By Danny Rice 1163031
#520338 I have looked around and don't find much concerning conversion of flyable to AI. However, I did try a little experiment. I copied a couple of my helicopters into the simobjects/airplane folder. Then I ran the sim and vpilot. Vpilot recognized the helicopters, listed them in the modelscanresult-prepar3dV4 file, and, indicated in the IsExcluded= as False. Vpilot also allowed me to designate one of the helicopter models as the default model.

Does this mean that Vpilot will now use the helicopters in model matching? I am certain it couldn't be that simple. Could it????

Danny
By Ross Carlson 887155
#520345 No, that just means that vpilot found the models. They weren't found before because I specifically exclude the helicopter folder when scanning for models.

It will still throw an error if it tries to use one of them.
By Craig Tomkins 1075089
#523420 Hi all,

If i can give you some AI models for helicopters can VPilot be configured to do the following:
1. Recognise helicopters and assign a default heli when the type code is incorrect or matching has been unsuccessful?
2. Read a bespoke libary for model matching rule set, that links to a AI model matching pack?

Not having a default heli is a nightmare for heli pilots and fixed wing pilots. There is nothing better then seeing a 737 levitate and zoom off into the distance! Happy to help the community with AI models (i.e. i will make some in blender!). But, not sure if VPilot has the capability to do it?
By Ross Carlson 887155
#523431
Craig Tomkins 1075089 wrote:1. Recognise helicopters and assign a default heli when the type code is incorrect or matching has been unsuccessful?


Unfortunately, the only way for vPilot to know that a user is flying a helicopter is for that user to enter the correct type code when connecting to the network. That is the only piece of data that is transmitted to other pilots which contains any information about the type of aircraft you are flying. In other words, there is no field in the transmitted data that indicates if the user is flying a prop, a jet, a sailplane, a blimp, a helicopter, etc. There is only the type code that the user enters.

That being said, vPilot does have a list of type code aliases which it uses to correct for invalid type codes. So if you are regularly seeing someone connect with an invalid helicopter type code, I could add entries to this list that would correct their type code before looking for a matching model. Let me know if you have any such invalid codes to add to the list.

Craig Tomkins 1075089 wrote:2. Read a bespoke libary for model matching rule set, that links to a AI model matching pack?


Yes, you can load custom model matching rules into vPilot, which map type codes to your models. Documentation is here:

http://vpilot.metacraft.com/Documentation2.aspx
By Johnny Coughlan 861497
#523456
Ross Carlson 887155 wrote:
Craig Tomkins 1075089 wrote:1. Recognise helicopters and assign a default heli when the type code is incorrect or matching has been unsuccessful?


Unfortunately, the only way for vPilot to know that a user is flying a helicopter is for that user to enter the correct type code when connecting to the network. That is the only piece of data that is transmitted to other pilots which contains any information about the type of aircraft you are flying. In other words, there is no field in the transmitted data that indicates if the user is flying a prop, a jet, a sailplane, a blimp, a helicopter, etc. There is only the type code that the user enters


Okay, this has been an annoyance of mine for a long time.

Like it or not, this is VATSIM where not every pilot know what code to use or how to go about finding it or hell, even know they've to put in a code.

As I use towerview for almost all my ATC sessions outside of CTR I've seen time and time again pilots not connecting with the correct code.

Ross can you not put in a basic safeguard instead of just one aircraft to pick if the code is unrecognizable?.

So for instance once you open vpilot and on the connection part have a drop down where you can select.....helicopter/single engine light/twin engine light/corporate jet/twin engine turboprop/twin engine commercial jet/four engine commercial jet....then they can enter the code.

At least this was if they get the code wrong a default aircraft type which we can set is tied to one of the drop downs and we have at least an aircraft to scale if the code is wrong.

Having a CRJ OR AIRBUS to represent a light Cessna with a wring code is just bad.
By Christoph Reule 1379750
#523460
Johnny Coughlan 861497 wrote:Ross can you not put in a basic safeguard instead of just one aircraft to pick if the code is unrecognizable?.

So for instance once you open vpilot and on the connection part have a drop down where you can select.....helicopter/single engine light/twin engine light/corporate jet/twin engine turboprop/twin engine commercial jet/four engine commercial jet....then they can enter the code.

At least this was if they get the code wrong a default aircraft type which we can set is tied to one of the drop downs and we have at least an aircraft to scale if the code is wrong.

Having a CRJ OR AIRBUS to represent a light Cessna with a wring code is just bad.


I principally second that. Recent improvements with version 2.1.13 are a step in the right direction. Something like mentioned above could also help with "ZZZZ" codes.
By Ross Carlson 887155
#523464
Johnny Coughlan 861497 wrote:Ross can you not put in a basic safeguard instead of just one aircraft to pick if the code is unrecognizable?.

So for instance once you open vpilot and on the connection part have a drop down where you can select.....helicopter/single engine light/twin engine light/corporate jet/twin engine turboprop/twin engine commercial jet/four engine commercial jet....then they can enter the code.

At least this was if they get the code wrong a default aircraft type which we can set is tied to one of the drop downs and we have at least an aircraft to scale if the code is wrong.


Unless I'm misunderstanding your suggestion, I think this idea is a step in the right direction, but it is incomplete. The reason I say that is because your solution gets us to the rough *category* of aircraft the user is flying, but that's it. As you suggest, vPilot would have to pick a default type code for each rough category. In many cases, that will still result in no model match because the default type code may not be a type that is flown by the airline the user is flying as.

I think it's safe to say that most (nearly all) users know the manufacturer and model of aircraft they're flying. They just don't always know the exact type code. So, it seems that the right way to address this problem is to help the user discover the right type code based on the information they have.

To that end, I suggest we allow the user to type free text (whatever they know about their aircraft) into a text box and be presented with a list of matches to choose from. The search results would display as the manufacturer, model name, and type code. Some example searches:

If I search for "Airbus", I would get:

Airbus A-318 (A318)
Airbus A-319 (A319)
Airbus A-320 (A320)
Airbus A-330-200 (A332)
Airbus A-330-300 (A333)
etc.

If I search for "Beech", I would get:

Beech Bonanza (BE33)
Beech King Air (BE10)
Beech Super King Air (BE20)
etc.

If I search for "737", I would get:

Boeing 737-200 (B732)
Boeing 737-300 (B733)
Boeing 737-400 (B734)
etc.

If I know my type code, and I search for e.g. "B738" I would only get a single result:

Boeing 737-800 (B738)

Obviously, natural combinations and partial matches would work as well, e.g. I could search for "boeing 737" or "Airbus 320" or even just "320" and still get the relevant matches. No search results would be displayed until at least two characters had been entered. (I think the minimum must be two, not something higher, so that searches for "B1" would work.)

The displayed manufacturer and model names would come from the ICAO type code registry.

I'm also considering pulling information via SimConnect for the loaded aircraft, and if matches are found from the "ATC TYPE" or "ATC MODEL" SimConnect vars, then those matches would be shown initially. I'm not sure if that's the right way to go, though, since those vars are populated from the aircraft.cfg file, and those values are often blatantly wrong, so it might be a step in the wrong direction. I'm just not sure how often they are wrong. Maybe I'll use the ATC MODEL variable only if it contains an exact match for a valid type code.

Thoughts?
By Johnny Coughlan 861497
#523473 Sorry for my less than elegant way of suggesting my idea ha! :D

Yes Ross I was suggesting a very basic way of at least getting the shape and size in proportion using the default aircraft with the sim of choice the pilot is using.

So when they load up vpilot as well as putting in the ICAO code of the aircraft, they select the style be it helicopter, single engine light, large twin commercial etc etc.

Then if the code they use is wrong, OR if they're flying some obscure light aircraft that doesn't even have an AI model, if they selected single engine light, a default Cessna will show on the network instead of a CRJ or A320. So you would have at least something visually resembling to scale what they're flying.

What you suggest is also very good and I obviously wasn't going to demand the sky so I kept it basic.

You'd be surprised the amount of pilots who fly with B737 selected in their code thinking they're covered although they needed B738.
By Trevor Hannant 1240481
#523474
Ross Carlson 887155 wrote:I'm also considering pulling information via SimConnect for the loaded aircraft, and if matches are found from the "ATC TYPE" or "ATC MODEL" SimConnect vars, then those matches would be shown initially. I'm not sure if that's the right way to go, though, since those vars are populated from the aircraft.cfg file, and those values are often blatantly wrong, so it might be a step in the wrong direction. I'm just not sure how often they are wrong. Maybe I'll use the ATC MODEL variable only if it contains an exact match for a valid type code.

Thoughts?


If they don't match a valid code, could a "suggested" list be shown instead? So would work the same way as someone typing in the wrong code but takes it from there rather than their typed input?
By Ross Carlson 887155
#523475
Johnny Coughlan 861497 wrote:You'd be surprised the amount of pilots who fly with B737 selected in their code thinking they're covered although they needed B738.


I seriously doubt that I'd be surprised. :)
By Ross Carlson 887155
#523476
Trevor Hannant 1240481 wrote:
Ross Carlson 887155 wrote:I'm also considering pulling information via SimConnect for the loaded aircraft, and if matches are found from the "ATC TYPE" or "ATC MODEL" SimConnect vars, then those matches would be shown initially. I'm not sure if that's the right way to go, though, since those vars are populated from the aircraft.cfg file, and those values are often blatantly wrong, so it might be a step in the wrong direction. I'm just not sure how often they are wrong. Maybe I'll use the ATC MODEL variable only if it contains an exact match for a valid type code.

Thoughts?


If they don't match a valid code, could a "suggested" list be shown instead? So would work the same way as someone typing in the wrong code but takes it from there rather than their typed input?


If I understand correctly, what you're suggesting is that I could take whatever value is in the ATC MODEL SimConnect variable, and pre-fill the type code box in the Connect window with that value. Essentially just pre-type it for the user. I would do that whether or not the ATC MODEL var contained a valid ICAO code.

I could do that, but I'm wondering if that would lead to frustration for users that know their valid type code. If such a user were, for example, flying an aircraft that had "B737-800" in the ATC MODEL field, they would have to manually change it to "B738" before connecting. That would get really annoying for users who know the right code.

At the very least, I would have to provide a way for "power users" to turn off this feature so that it wouldn't try to read the ATC MODEL variable. I always try to resist adding more options like this, because users are often unaware that the option exists and they just deal with the annoyance of having to enter the right type code, and never speak up about it. That's why I'm thinking it should only prefill if the value in the ATC MODEL var is a valid type code.
By Christoph Reule 1379750
#523480
Ross Carlson 887155 wrote:That's why I'm thinking it should only prefill if the value in the ATC MODEL var is a valid type code.


Good point. Sounds like a reasonable solution.
Reading the ATC MODEL var should be an option, not a must, IMO.
By Ross Carlson 887155
#523482
Christoph Reule 1379750 wrote:Reading the ATC MODEL var should be an option, not a must, IMO.


Even if it's only read if it contains a valid ICAO type code? Why do you say that?