Robert White 1081678 Posted January 7, 2010 at 12:16 AM Posted January 7, 2010 at 12:16 AM I am using the current Airac and searching for a route between KEWR and EGNX. The 3 routes that show up say "Unavailable". Vroute says that UN517 is an unknown airway. I pulled up the charts and no matter how I rearranged the flight plan Vroute wont accept it. I tried looking at routes between airports that are close and those accepted routes use the same airways and fixes that Vroute tells me are unknown. If someone could enter a route from KEWR to EGNX that uses Airac 0913 I would appreciate it. I just want to go flying. Oh and my FMC took the unavailable route no problem. Thanks for any help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ernesto Alvarez 818262 Posted January 7, 2010 at 12:29 AM Posted January 7, 2010 at 12:29 AM post the route your trying Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert White 1081678 Posted January 7, 2010 at 12:33 AM Author Posted January 7, 2010 at 12:33 AM Here are the 3 unavailable routes. There isnt anything wrong with them that I can see. MERIT HFD PUT BOS BRADD N61B VIXUN LOGSU 4950N 5040N 5130N 5120N DINIM GIPER UN517 SHA DCT LIFFY UL975 WAL LGA V433 BDR V229 HFD J42 PUT J581 ENE J573 YYG YQX KOBEV 5050N 5140N 5230N 5320N MALOT BURAK UN536 DUB UL975 MALUD DCT JFK A523 FLANN G432 BDA A632 TOTEM UA632 ANU UL695 EGIMI UL375 DIKEB UN741 KENOX SVT IPERA UN873 BAKUL AVANT UL980 MID UM185 OCK UH52 HEMEL UT420 WELIN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ernesto Alvarez 818262 Posted January 7, 2010 at 12:38 AM Posted January 7, 2010 at 12:38 AM checked them against fsnav, all look ok with the airways. no clue why vroute wont take them, but what are you trying to enter them in vroute for? the flight planning tool? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert White 1081678 Posted January 7, 2010 at 12:47 AM Author Posted January 7, 2010 at 12:47 AM Well my original plan was to pull up a route and then fly it after updating the airac in my FMC but then this route problem cropped up and I did a bit of very interesting research about north atlantic tracks and it turned into a puzzle I couldn't put down. But now I'm thinking its just a bug. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randy Tyndall 1087023 Posted January 7, 2010 at 04:10 AM Posted January 7, 2010 at 04:10 AM I tried submitting a route into Vroutes that was supposedly the preferred route of a VA I fly (for the Fuel Management tab info on Vroute premium). Involved the J191 Airway between Hopewell and Another VOR North of JFK that I honestly can't recall now. Vroute kept rejecting my route. I got out the chart (I bought the complete US Hi-Enroutes from MyPilotStore.com) and discovered the max altitude along the J191 at points was FL220 and I was trying to submit one at FL370. Might look at that angle on yours. Randy Tyndall - KBOI ZLA I-11/vACC Portugal P4 “A ship is always safe in the harbor. But that’s not why they build ships” --Michael Bevington ID 814931, Former VATSIM Board of Governors Vice President of Pilot Training Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert White 1081678 Posted January 7, 2010 at 09:52 AM Author Posted January 7, 2010 at 09:52 AM Great thought but didn't help. I tried all the alts nothing helped. Its gotta be a routing bug. Ive tried everything. I even took approved routes from stations that were further away on both ends that had similar routes that were approved and Vroute denied them. I guess I shoulda stuck with the freebie stuff. Apparently the newest airacs arent fully supported. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michal Rok Posted January 7, 2010 at 09:13 PM Posted January 7, 2010 at 09:13 PM Would you please post not just the route, but also the rejection message? I could check myself, but I don't know which AIRAC you use... Latest AIRACs are fully supported, no exceptions and no shortcuts were taken to deliver the best possible service. Michal vroute.net founder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert White 1081678 Posted January 8, 2010 at 02:34 AM Author Posted January 8, 2010 at 02:34 AM Im using Airac 0913. All 3 flight plans listed between KEWR - EGNX show unavailable. FL290-FL410 MERIT HFD PUT BOS BRADD N61B VIXUN LOGSU 4950N 5040N 5130N 5120N DINIM GIPER UN517 SHA DCT LIFFY UL975 WAL ERROR: Unknown airway/waypoint UN517 (or SHA is not part of UN517, or UN517 is an airway that does not include GIPER) FL310-FL400 LGA V433 BDR V229 HFD J42 PUT J581 ENE J573 YYG YQX KOBEV 5050N 5140N 5230N 5320N MALOT BURAK UN536 DUB UL975 MALUD ERROR: Unknown airway/waypoint UN536 (or DUB is not part of UN536, or UN536 is an airway that does not include BURAK), ERROR: Unknown airway/waypoint UL975 (or MALUD is not part of UL975, or UL975 is an airway that does not include DUB) FL330-FL350 DCT JFK A523 FLANN G432 BDA A632 TOTEM UA632 ANU UL695 EGIMI UL375 DIKEB UN741 KENOX SVT IPERA UN873 BAKUL AVANT UL980 MID UM185 OCK UH52 HEMEL UT420 WELIN ERROR: Unknown airway/waypoint A523 (or FLANN is not part of A523, or A523 is an airway that does not include JFK), ERROR: Unknown airway/waypoint G432 (or BDA is not part of G432, or G432 is an airway that does not include FLANN), ERROR: Unknown airway/w Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michal Rok Posted January 8, 2010 at 05:14 AM Posted January 8, 2010 at 05:14 AM Hi, this topic has been recently discussed in our support forum (http://support.vroute.net/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=883). In AIRAC 0913, the Shannon (EISN) FIR has been declared free route airspace, and there are no airways there anymore. Instead, one should fly direct from 1st to last waypoint in EISN. I recently fixed 500+ routes to solve this problem, but seems like I'm not done with all these issues. The first two routes you quoted are definitely faulty due to this problem, the 3rd one is unacceptable anyway (since it does not use NAT), so please send a removal request at the next opportunity. Please try: LGA V433 BDR V229 HFD J42 PUT J581 ENE J573 YYG YQX KOBEV 5050N 5140N 5230N 5320N MALOT BURAK LIFFY UL975 MALUD (LIFFY is the 1st waypoint on UL975 on the border of Ireland and UK, you can also cross out BURAK if you like) regards, Michal vroute.net founder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert White 1081678 Posted January 8, 2010 at 01:21 PM Author Posted January 8, 2010 at 01:21 PM Using your suggested route. LGA V433 BDR V229 HFD J42 PUT J581 ENE J573 YYG YQX KOBEV 5050N 5140N 5230N 5320N MALOT BURAK LIFFY UL975 MALUD ERRORS AT FL = 340: (FPL-LOT001-IS -B738/M-SDRWY/S -KEWR1150 -N0430F340 LGA V433 BDR V229 HFD J42 PUT J581 ENE J573 YYG YQX KOBEV 50N050W 51N040W 52N030W 53N020W MALOT BURAK LIFFY UL975 MALUD -EGNX0818 -0) -ERROR ROUTE130: UNKNOWN DESIGNATOR BURAK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michal Rok Posted January 8, 2010 at 02:14 PM Posted January 8, 2010 at 02:14 PM Thanks for pointing out - I missed the fact that 12W reporting points were moved to 14W, so the new BURAK is GISTI. The correct route (already submitted) is: LGA V433 BDR V229 HFD J42 PUT J581 ENE J573 YYG YQX KOBEV 5050N 5140N 5230N 5320N MALOT DCT GISTI DCT LIFFY UL975 MALUD Michał vroute.net founder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert White 1081678 Posted January 8, 2010 at 08:46 PM Author Posted January 8, 2010 at 08:46 PM Nice. Thanks for your help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Murphy Posted March 1, 2010 at 03:49 PM Posted March 1, 2010 at 03:49 PM Hi folks. When you check a route that crosses the Atlantic, does it take into account the current NATs or just the ones at the time that route was entered into the database? Too often I have pilots with old NATs. No fault to them they thought it was correct. FYI - i purchased VRoute and i love it! I also have it on my iPhone and love it! Michal you have done a great job with this program. Thanks! Tim Help a newbie! http://czqm.ca QM/QX Instructor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michal Rok Posted March 1, 2010 at 06:04 PM Posted March 1, 2010 at 06:04 PM Tim, at the moment vroute is a flight plan _database_, so it does not create routes on its own and uses the one supplied by users earlier. Obviously, it's not able to amend the routes to match current NATs. I've been preparing for some time to create a "NAT wizard" in vroute, but there's no release date yet. Michal vroute.net founder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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