Barry Kensett 861979 Posted October 17, 2005 at 08:43 AM Posted October 17, 2005 at 08:43 AM Following a query raised with me by a controller I am trying to find any policy regarding supersonic operations of Concorde over land on VATSIM. In the real world of course such operations were only permitted on a limited basis due to sonic bangs. Vatsim and MSFS do not represent sonic bangs in the headset and there does not have to be the same restriction. To have a fair spread of controllers and also to keep flights to a reasonable length there would not appear to be an objection to supersonic flights across the Continents. To fly subsonic means a constraint on the Concorde optimum of 400 knots at FL280; a bit restrictive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Finney 810884 Posted October 17, 2005 at 01:24 PM Posted October 17, 2005 at 01:24 PM Hello Barry I am unable to answer your question regarding VATSIM policy on supersonic ops over land, I am certain that you will get an answer to this in the thread. Please allow me the opportunity to comment with regards to the "realism" aspect of the aircraft on VATSIM. If you are trying to simulate real world SSC ops then as you have found, you are somewhat restricted to the routes to what the real world held when this aircraft was operational. Flying other routes with this aircraft at operational supersonic speeds over land using a country's domestic route structure will at best be impractical due to the nature and physical aspects of that airways system. IF a speed restriction is not imposed to go along with your prefiled plan using the overland routes, the only stumbling block that I can imagine that you would encounter would be in maintaining your selected route with regard to turn radius on the airways structure. It all depends on the route that you will be flying and whilst the majority if not all divisions in VATSIM prefer pilots to use "standard routes" even then your choice of route to allow greater turn radii than for example a subsonic aircraft at M0.84 may not fall into the "realism" category. At the end of the day, it all depends on how much realism you want to put into your flying on VATSIM, that is always left to the individual and I think that I would be correct in saying that realism is not part of VATSIM policy when it comes down to pilots online. The only restriction I am aware of in some ACC's is the "direct GPS" in the flight routing. Hopefully, you may be able to perform your flights unrestricted on VATSIM with local VACC policy compliance, I wish you good luck and happy flying. Best Regards Dan www.kadair.org.uk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Haworth 882436 Posted October 21, 2005 at 05:37 PM Posted October 21, 2005 at 05:37 PM To fly subsonic means a constraint on the Concorde optimum of 400 knots at FL280; a bit restrictive. If I could just correct you there Barry. 400kts at FL280 almost equates to M095 with this Mach number being the optimum subsonic cruise speed. However, you can hold and successfully fly M095 all the way up to FL410. cheers Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Heaney 879309 Posted October 21, 2005 at 08:22 PM Posted October 21, 2005 at 08:22 PM Ok, I'm having a deja-vu here, what happened to the other thread? Or is this the same thread, with all the replies deleted? CONFUSED. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Campbell 907200 Posted November 24, 2005 at 10:25 PM Posted November 24, 2005 at 10:25 PM My 2p is... Concorde: Flying subsonic is a far bigger strain on ATC than flying supersonic. When Concorde starts to climb for Mach2, it's soon long gone out of any airspace CTR need to worry about, FL480-FL600 is the domain only of Concorde, Tu-144 and military aircraft (to my knowledge). The only thing that would need considering is that Concorde does NOT follow the airways below, but tracks offset from them, so that in case of an engine failure or emergency (or pilot screw up) it can quickly drop (like a stone) into the busy upper airspace without 'scattering the pigeons'. At M0.95 crossing Europe on the way back from Bahrain at FL340 is a mine field dodging 'slow movers' like 737's as you are always slowly catching them. With no ATC on, you have to watch like a hawk on ServInfo and FSNav and sound your horn at intersections LOL As to the original question, personally I don't mach land unless I have a historical president of Concorde doing so on that route at one time. I don't think Concorde pilots should be stopped from flying where they want supersonic. Maybe... the policy should be that pilots must request permission from the relevant countries ATC before filing a flight plan. I'd recommend you check Concorde flight plans have a sensible TOD and/or DECEL point marked. Without this, you might find a newbie 'dropping in' to a busy TMA at Mach1.5, descending at 8,000fpm, because he didn't know where to descend. That would be a bit hairy. Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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