New Member with some questions!

[Michael Rybinski 1172387]

Hey guys, I just signed up for VATSIM after seeing some youtube videos today. Im an aspiring pilot but I just have some general questions that maybe you guys can help answer. It seems like there are a whole bunch of sub-communities under the VATSIM umbrella....and I have no idea where to start. Are there groups out there that work on training new pilots? Or is it just something I need to study on my own and learn as I go? This seems like a really great community to be a part of, and I'm really looking forward to becoming more involved. Thanks in advance for the help!

[Ernesto Alvarez 818262]

if you want training, in the US theres the ZLA pilot cert program

http://pilotcerts.laartcc.org/

[Michael Rybinski 1172387]

if you want training, in the US theres the ZLA pilot cert program

http://pilotcerts.laartcc.org/

 

Looks great, but as I mentioned before it seems like theres hundreds of various locations that I'd need to load into VRC and whatnot, are all the various locations connected under one community of people (Ie North America United States) or is each one different?

[Ernesto Alvarez 818262]

confused, do you want to learn to fly or ATC?

 

if you want to fly, nothing to do with VRC.

[Daniel Hawton]

Hey guys, I just signed up for VATSIM after seeing some youtube videos today. Im an aspiring pilot but I just have some general questions that maybe you guys can help answer. It seems like there are a whole bunch of sub-communities under the VATSIM umbrella....and I have no idea where to start. Are there groups out there that work on training new pilots? Or is it just something I need to study on my own and learn as I go? This seems like a really great community to be a part of, and I'm really looking forward to becoming more involved. Thanks in advance for the help!

 

To fly, you need a flight simulator (Microsoft's Flight Sim 9, Flight Sim X, or X-Plane) and a pilot client (FSInn or Squawkbox for Microsoft's Flight Sims, and XSquawkbox for X-Plane). For help with training on how to fly, visit that link Ernesto posted to ZLA's Pilot Program. But to fly, you need a flight sim first.

[Michael Rybinski 1172387]

confused, do you want to learn to fly or ATC?

 

if you want to fly, nothing to do with VRC.

 

I was really just checking it out to listen in on some ATC transmissions, though I guess going for that first kinda through me off.

 

To fly, you need a flight simulator (Microsoft's Flight Sim 9, Flight Sim X, or X-Plane) and a pilot client (FSInn or Squawkbox for Microsoft's Flight Sims, and XSquawkbox for X-Plane). For help with training on how to fly, visit that link Ernesto posted to ZLA's Pilot Program. But to fly, you need a flight sim first.

 

Yeah I have FSX, I'm guessing FSInn and Squawkbox are what you use to communicate with ATC?

[Daniel Hawton]

confused, do you want to learn to fly or ATC?

 

if you want to fly, nothing to do with VRC.

 

I was really just checking it out to listen in on some ATC transmissions, though I guess going for that first kinda through me off.

 

To fly, you need a flight simulator (Microsoft's Flight Sim 9, Flight Sim X, or X-Plane) and a pilot client (FSInn or Squawkbox for Microsoft's Flight Sims, and XSquawkbox for X-Plane). For help with training on how to fly, visit that link Ernesto posted to ZLA's Pilot Program. But to fly, you need a flight sim first.

 

Yeah I have FSX, I'm guessing FSInn and Squawkbox are what you use to communicate with ATC?

 

Yup. Grab FSInn OR Squawkbox. For help visit those areas on the forum. Welcome!

 

Also visit the PRC, it's a good guide to help you get started. www.vatsim.net/prc

[Larry James 901346]

Hey guys, I just signed up for VATSIM after seeing some youtube videos today. Im an aspiring pilot but I just have some general questions that maybe you guys can help answer. It seems like there are a whole bunch of sub-communities under the VATSIM umbrella....and I have no idea where to start. Are there groups out there that work on training new pilots? Or is it just something I need to study on my own and learn as I go? This seems like a really great community to be a part of, and I'm really looking forward to becoming more involved. Thanks in advance for the help!

 

How are you doing, Michael. If you're familiar with Flight Simulator you probably are much closer to enjoying VATSIM as you think. There are a number of training facilities that are available for with VATSIM. But you don't have to be an advance flight simulator pilot to actually fly on VATSIM. One of the missions of VATSIM is to make this hobby available for everyone. You can actually learn as you go as many VATSIMer have.

 

Take a look at:

 

VATSIM Quickstart Guide:

http://www.vatsim.net/pilots/quickstart

 

-- L. James

 

--

L. D. James

[email protected]

www.apollo3.com/~ljames

[Michael Rybinski 1172387]

Awesome, thanks for the help guys, happy flying!

[Garry Morris 920567]

You too! Welcome to VATSIM.

 

The key is to be ready to learn. As long as you're making an effort to learn, and avoid incredibly busy airspace until you're comfortable, controllers will love having you around.

[Keith Smith]

The key is to be ready to learn. As long as you're making an effort to learn, and avoid incredibly busy airspace until you're comfortable, controllers will love having you around.

 

Gary,

 

I'm not sure I've ever seen the idea expressed quite so eloquently and succinctly. That is _precisely_ the things for a new person to keep in mind as they begin using the network. If they do those things, they can't really go wrong. Nice job.

 

You make a good point when you say "avoid incredibly busy airspace" as opposed to the more traditional "avoid busy airspace." I think you're dead on.

[Matthew Bartels]

 

The key is to be ready to learn. As long as you're making an effort to learn, and avoid incredibly busy airspace until you're comfortable, controllers will love having you around.

 

Truer words have never been spoken on this issue. If only this was posted on signing up.

[Larry James 901346]

 

The key is to be ready to learn. As long as you're making an effort to learn, and avoid incredibly busy airspace until you're comfortable, controllers will love having you around.

 

Truer words have never been spoken on this issue. If only this was posted on signing up.

 

I know the suggestion to avoid busy (very busy) space is emphasized by many. But it’s not something I did when I was new. I used Servinfo to look for busy spaces and paid attention to the flow.

 

There was a tutorial in the PRC at that time that suggested for the users to complete (which at the time it was worded in such a way that I thought it was a requirement).

 

I studied the reading material and took the test. It said you could take the test as many times as you want to and it would record your best. If I got less than 100 percent right I’d study the material and take the test again. There were about 10 lessons, each having a test at the end. I repeated two or three of them.

 

I practiced a lot using Flight Simulator’s built in ATC. Since I stutter when I talk, I read aloud the pilot’s part of the builtin ATC dialog and practiced to be able to speak as fluid as I could.

 

My sessions when I first started were almost always KLAX to KSFO at the busiest times. I never got the impression that I was disrupting anything. Maybe it’s the controllers there in knowing how to handle the load. But they always made me feel extremely welcome and in the right place.

 

I put newbie in my comment for the first 5 or 6 sessions (maybe less).

 

The quickstart guide suggests that a user log into the network and listen. It also suggests that the user logs into Liveatc and listen. There are times when I see just about as many glitches between the controllers and pilots on Liveatc as I see on VATSIM. At times I have to wonder, is the bar higher on VATSIM than real-world?

 

I don’t believe a person should request clearance before he’s sure he can perform the minimum requirement as prescribed in the PRC. That’s mainly the ability to taxi to and from an [Mod - Happy Thoughts]igned runway and gate or ramp… to be able to handle their aircraft in such to be able to take off and land from an [Mod - Happy Thoughts]igned runway… to be able to fly [Mod - Happy Thoughts]igned speed, altitude and direction… etc. If the user can perform the requirements for VATSIM, how many pilots and controllers would have their day ruined by those pilots?

 

Since the controllers are trained, I would hope they would practice and become familiar with a method to give runway/taxiway, speed, altitude, speed and direction to the pilots that connect and accept the challenge when it gets busy. From my uneducated opinion, I would expect there are some buffer methods such as instructing go around if there are too many aircraft to handle the available runways, and understandable buffer methods for pilots to hold short before giving them takeoff clearances.

 

If it had been strongly suggested to me not to connect in busy space, I would have honored it. I’m glad I didn’t get that impression when I first joined. Some of the appeal would have been lost. I got the impression that the key was for me to get ready offline by practicing the minimum requirement for connecting and requesting clearance.

 

Another thing that many people suggest to new users is to find a controller that isn’t busy and log on and have them guide them through what to do. Personally I don’t agree with that either. I believe if a person wants guidance and instructions they should use the Flight With Me forum and ask someone to join and help them. Or they should ask questions in this forum as this user did. Of course, I’m not a controller and it might be part of the controller’s requirement to be prepared to teach pilots. But I’m almost certain (again, unless it’s one of the written duties) that I wouldn’t be connecting to teach. I’d be connecting to control. I’d hate to have someone look at my space and decide I’m not busy and they can come and chat with me. I’d hope they would connect and request clearance and be prepared for me to perform the duty I connected to perform, and that’s to control.

 

By nature I’d be friendly to the pilots that try to chat with me whether I had lots of people in my space or a few people in my space. It’s me that would be burden to trying to suggest the forum for their mentoring in such a way as not to turn off a pilot. Or to tell the pilot that I could set aside a time to mentor the pilot by appointment, which I’d do whether I had lots of aircraft in my space or a few.

 

The gist of my message is that a pilot should study the procedures and requirements and ensure they meet them before requesting clearance. I’m certain (as mentioned in the quick start guide) that being able to follow and understand the builtin ATC facility will give the necessary learning curb in this capacity; and to have the initiative not to disrupt the network; and to ask questions that are not clear on the forums such as this user had done, is a very good way to be up to par with the mission of VATSIM.

 

I don’t believe a person over the required age of 13 can be so far out of it that they would overly burden and ruin the day for the other pilots and controllers without almost blatantly trying to when following the PRC’s published expectation and rules of conduct.

 

-- L. James

 

--

L. D. James

[email protected]

http://www.apollo3.com/~ljames

[Garry Morris 920567]

That's well posted Larry. By incredibly busy, I'm referencing the situation where you have a solo center controller trying to handle an airspace like ZLA.

 

Keith, funnily enough, some of your busy nights I've heard while p[Mod - Happy Thoughts]ing through ZLA were exactly what I had in mind when I posted that. If a new pilot can fly course, altitude, heading and ILS on demand, it's not a huge deal. I know, however, my first flights on the network (made in ZAB on a slow night) would have been disasters if I'd been trying to fly to LAX on a very busy evening with a solo center controller online.

[Garry Morris 920567]

Larry, as to your response regarding controllers. When I was controlling (I haven't had much flying or controlling time lately and am extended LOA from ZAB), I really enjoyed Tower. I created no small amount of heartburn amongst my trainers because I really had no interest in Approach or above, and was beaten from S1 to S3 by an exasperated ATM after adding "Longest S1" to my signature. A number of times while working ABQ or TUS I had a brand new pilot connect and ask if I could work with them on their first flight. I really enjoyed getting them into a pattern and helping them with their first flight. There was usually another aircraft or two I was working at the same time, and the workload was very manageable, as well as providing a few extra airplanes for the new pilot to see and interact with.

 

Granted, a local controller with a few airplanes is going to be far more likely to want to work with a new pilot as compared to a Center controller with a number of aircraft in their airspace.

 

Ultimately, Larry, a lot of our new pilots aren't like you. They don't do the due diligence of practicing offline and taking the tests and reading the material very closely. They've maybe flown some flights with FS ATC and they hop right into LAX to do their first flight. And you can clearly hear on the radio when two or three of them do this - it's highly disruptive, creates extra stress and workload on the controller (I recall one night where pilots weren't even responding to instructions and Keith's tone getting more and more sarcastic - you could hear the frustration in there - I consider him one of the better controllers on the network and the moreso since he can keep some semblance of order even those situations) and disrupts every pilot in that area. If a busy controller is trying desperately to get a new pilot onto the localizer (or spin him because he's completely missed the intercept for the 3rd time), that controller isn't available to give me my landing or takeoff clearance, or hand me off to the next center, or give me descent clearance. That makes my night less fun, and makes every other prepared pilot on that frequency frustrated as well.

 

Having heard a pilot call up ZLA and ask when they were going to intercept the ILS, after having heard Keith desperately trying to contact them for two or three minutes prior, and hearing Keith's "there you are, the ILS is a distant memory, turn left heading...." I can understand a need for newer pilots to make a flight or two in less busy airspace so they can find out all the things they don't know in a forgiving environment prior to trying to shoot an ILS at LAX with two in front and two in trail.

[Eric Martinez 1136244]

VATSIM at first, seems like 90% of the flights are in jets, under IFR. Im not part of any group or training program, and I still enjoy the communtiy. Yes there are lots of groups, but i think that shy pilots are always welcome. Slow prop planes, VFR, and events are my favs. You will notice also that the skill range between pilots is from actual pilots relaxing, to complete novice pilots doing airport hops.

 

another thing worth mentioning...the ATC are always nice, sometimes when I mess up ATC will always help, especially when I got "FULL CHARTS" in my flight plan remarks. ATC love when you do your homework!