Display line logic issues...

[Kent Kasten 868422]

I am having a problem determining the correct logic to use given the following:

 

When I'm online as ALO_APP_SECT (Waterloo) and CID_APP_SECT (Cedar Rapids) is also online with no other active controllers, as ALO_APP I should see a "red" outline around CID_APP_SECT using the following display line (the display line is under the CID_APP Sectorline definition):

 

DISPLAY:ALO_APP_SECT:ALO_APP_SECT:CID_APP_SECT

 

This works perfectly given the above scenario; however, it also works when a center sector comes online (e.g. CHI_E_CTR) because it owns CID_APP_SECT when its not online. In this case only ALO_APP_SECT should get a "red" boundary, not CID_APP_SECT as well. By commenting out the above display it will solve the problem when CHI_E_CTR comes online, but doesn't allow the first scenario to work.

 

Is there anything I can do to resolve this issue?

 

Thanks,

Kent

[Stephan Boerner 945550]

Without knowing the airspace it is hard to say anything, but it sounds like everything is fine. There are probably some vertical boundaries that cause the border to highlight. If the border should be visible with App online, it should be no different with Ctr covering App. It's the same sector, the same neighbor, just a different controller. I don't see why Ctr should have a different border (in relation to the other App) than the App whose airspace he is covering.

[Kent Kasten 868422]

Without knowing the airspace it is hard to say anything, but it sounds like everything is fine. There are probably some vertical boundaries that cause the border to highlight. If the border should be visible with App online, it should be no different with Ctr covering App. It's the same sector, the same neighbor, just a different controller. I don't see why Ctr should have a different border (in relation to the other App) than the App whose airspace he is covering.

 

I understand that by not knowing the airspace its difficult to provide a solid answer. Lets just use a generic model to describe what is going on and what results I'm looking for. From the ground up sectorcircle definitions are created for each control tower (TWR). From there there are multiple approach/departure (APP/DEP) sectorlines. From there there are 4 center (CTR) positions (North Center, East Center, South Center and West Center) which divide the entire center into four quadrants. Given this model ownership is TWR, APP, DEP, and CTR in that order. The center ownership is based on the quadrant location.

 

In what I outlined previously, If I'm APP1 and my neighbor APP2 sector come online, I should see a "red" line around the APP2 sector indicating that APP2 is actually online, which is correct for the following display line logic.

 

DISPLAY:APP1_SECT:APP1_SECT:APP2_SECT

 

However, the problem is that when APP1 and CTR are the only controllers online and the center ownership for APP1 and CTR are the same. The previous display line above evaluates to true turning on APP2 "red" border indicating that APP2 is online not CTR, which is incorrect. If CTR and APP1 are the only controllers, then only APP1 border should be highlighted in "red".

 

I hope this help explain the situation a little better.

 

Thanks,

Kent

[Todor Atanasov 878664]

OK, the APP1 - APP2 division line is the same as the CTR - APP2 ?

[Stephan Boerner 945550]

However, the problem is that when APP1 and CTR are the only controllers online and the center ownership for APP1 and CTR are the same. The previous display line above evaluates to true turning on APP2 "red" border indicating that APP2 is online not CTR, which is incorrect. If CTR and APP1 are the only controllers, then only APP1 border should be highlighted in "red".

 

I hope this help explain the situation a little better.

Just to confirm ... you meant "ownership for APP2 and CTR are the same"? Because otherwise the whole scenario doesn't make sense.

 

You are misunderstanding the concept here. It doesn't matter if APP2 or CTR is online, the only thing that matters is, that APP1 and APP2 sectors are covered by different controllers, which is true in both cases, no matter if APP2 or CTR is the controller who covers the APP2 sector. So it seems to be working as expected.

[Kent Kasten 868422]

Just to confirm ... you meant "ownership for APP2 and CTR are the same"?

 

You are correct ownership for APP2 and CTR are the same. I also agree that the logic of the display line is working correctly in both cases. I was hoping for a solution around this issue since the APP2 controller really isn't online in the second case. I suppose improved display line logic statements within ES are really needed to solve this issue, something that can provide a true "IF...THEN...ELSE" functionality.

 

Thanks,

Kent

[Stephan Boerner 945550]

Help me understand it ... Why does it make a difference to you if the sector is covert by App or Ctr?

[Todor Atanasov 878664]

I don't see a problem with the logic. You are APP1, if APP2 is online, you see the border highlighted, showing you that you have a neighbouring sector online, with who you can coordinated and so on. No APP2 is offline, but the CTR, is online. As in VATSIM a top-down structure is implemented, CTR will control APP2 too. So you see the border highlighted again, because you again have a neighbouring sector online, with who you can coordinated and so on. If you want to see, if the position is online, use the Controller list.

[Alen Smriko 1034823]

If I understand you correctly...

My suggestion is that you create a fake sector, something like this:

CIRCLE_SECTORLINE:FAKE:x:y:1    ; where x and y are coordinates

(...)

SECTORLINE:CID_APP_SECT
DISPLAY:ALO_APP_SECT:ALO_APP_SECT:FAKE
COORD:...

(...)

SECTOR:FAKE:00000:00001
OWNER:<CID SECTOR OWNER, PROBABLY CID_APP>    ;  note, only one owner, no CTR
BORDER:FAKE

 

That would help you, if I understood you correctly...