Looking for a General Aviation Charter VA

[Lee Breedlove 1196677]

Hey folks!

 

 

I have some odd requests in what I'm looking for in a virtual airline. I've spent hours searching google to no avail, but I'm looking for a general aviation charter airline, and more specifically one that might simulate aircraft ownership...

 

 

What I mean by aircraft ownership is something that will allow me to possibly take out a loan or do a lease to own on a plane. I'm flying the FSD International Cessna 337 Skymaster in a custom paintjob, and I would like to fly for an outfit, but in the Skymaster and my custom livery, kind of like I own it...

 

 

I don't even know if that's done in real life, but I imagine it would be similar to a truck driver who is an owner operator and on contract with a company. Like I said, I don't know if this is even done in aviation however.

 

I have heard of FS Economy, but their prices are a bit inflated (which is real I suppose) but I couldn't earn enough money to purchase and maintain planes, due to my real life work schedule, which was a bit disheartening...

 

So anyways, folks, I would really appreciate any suggestions on some sort of Virtual Airline that would allow me to do that, if any at all, or if I'm asking for too much!

 

 

Thanks in advance!

-Lee

[Salvatore Barcia 1055319]

The New York Flying Club is a great VATSIM Virtual Airline that consist of general aviation flying in the NY area. As far as simulating ownership and whatnot, I'm not too sure.

 

www.newyorkflyingclub.net

[Kyle Ramsey 810181]

fseconomy.com

[Lee Breedlove 1196677]

The New York Flying Club is a great VATSIM Virtual Airline that consist of general aviation flying in the NY area. As far as simulating ownership and whatnot, I'm not too sure.

 

http://www.newyorkflyingclub.net

 

 

Thanks, I'll take a look at it, although I was hoping to stay somewhere near the west coast, but that isn't too important.

 

Oh, and Kyle, I have tried FSE, but I couldn't afford anything because I can't dedicate so much time to flying...

[Kyle Ramsey 810181]

I understand Lee, however if you join one or more of the groups (VA) you have access to their airplanes at no cost to you at all. Save your pilot fees and before you know it you're buying your first airplane.

 

Good luck on your search. The only other GA oriented group I know of that has a purchase airplane aspect to it is Deer Valley Flying Club.

[Brian Fuller 973577]

If you are referring to a "Simulation" that lets you own your own plane in game, this means you have to earn money in game to be able to buy a plane in game.

 

Any group/va/club that offers this type of feature will do it along the same lines, you fly enough to earn money then you buy what you need. So do you want a group/va/club that gives you a free plane that you own and you make no money?

 

I guess I don't get your objective.

 

Tell you what, I'll buy any aircraft of your choice for you under 50k (on FSE), it will be part of a group and you can fly it as if it was your own (maint costs, fuel costs etc). When you have paid back the 50k (no interest), it's yours outright.

 

The New York Flying Club is a great VATSIM Virtual Airline that consist of general aviation flying in the NY area. As far as simulating ownership and whatnot, I'm not too sure.

 

http://www.newyorkflyingclub.net

 

 

Thanks, I'll take a look at it, although I was hoping to stay somewhere near the west coast, but that isn't too important.

 

Oh, and Kyle, I have tried FSE, but I couldn't afford anything because I can't dedicate so much time to flying...

[Lee Breedlove 1196677]

Brian, that's very generous, but I guess I wasnt clear enough...

 

 

I do want to have to fly to make money. I guess I was looking for more of a loan system, and in my honest opinion, (Good or bad) FSE has raised the prices way too freakin high.

 

 

Example: A used Cessna Skymaster in real life, good condition (a '79) is about 135,000 dollars.

 

On FSE they're going upwards of a quarter to half a million... the last I checked. Seems a bit outrageous...

 

On FSE I owned an AN-14, flew the wings off of it, but the Russian Instrumentation was too difficult for me to understand, so I took a loan out and financed a Grumman G-44 Widgeon...The interest and payments on the Widgeon were so ridiculously high I ended up selling the AN-14 to make payments. Then, because I couldn't devote every waking hour to flying on FSE to pay the remainder, I watched as my Grumman was repossessed. FS Economy's prices arent accurate for someone who isn't retired and able to devote a lot of time to it.

 

I hope that clears it up some?

 

EDIT: Info on real world Skymaster Pricing (Leastways, where I got mine): http://www.skymaster.com/listings.htm

[Brian Fuller 973577]

Player loans are available in FSE, just just need to post and ask for one.

 

FSE doesn't use Year of the aircraft as a pricing model, just airframe hours. So you can probably find someone selling one that has 500 hours on it for that price, you just need to ask around.

[Ernesto Alvarez 818262]

dont expect real world prices in FSE either since its technically way to easy as it is to make money thats why youll notice the prices arent at the same levels as real world. different economics.

 

cheapest skymaster in FSE for example at the moment is about 100k more then real world.

 

personally i dont recommend loans for beginners. way to easy to burn out making the payments. theres TONS of groups however that you can fly for while you save up to get your own. altho by your description, you made a deal with the wrong people if the interest was out of this world. none of the folks ive dealt with was that much.

 

not sure how long you tried out FSE, but this tends to happen to lots of new members who get too far ahead before they can actually sustain themselves. cant rush it, remember you can also rent or even lease before buying. theres different ways to make it work, just comes with experience.

 

but FSE may not be everyones cup of tea and theres nothing wrong with that either. theres other groups out there

 

im not retired btw, im a college student and in FSE own several aircraft (DC6, DC3, Falcon 7x, Cessna 421, and several others). its not something out of reach for non regular users you just have to put in time and lots of patience

Edited November 18, 2011 at 04:44 PM by Guest

[Brian Sommers]

keep in mind that FSE was not and probably will never be intended to replicate REAL WORLD AVIATION/PRICES...etc.

 

That an many other "gamey" things is what keeps me AWAY from FSE

[Lee Breedlove 1196677]

Well, this is all true, and yes, the interest was crazy high.

 

 

Maybe I'll try out FSE again, see about getting a loan, or leasing. Leasing was just being implemented when I burnt out trying to payback that loan.

 

 

Thanks gentlemen for talking with me. Brian, if you have work let me know. I think we've chatted before on FSE, I'm Hero540.

[tom van der elst]

I own 1 plane in FSE and I fly on average about 1 hour a day on it.

The last few days I have been battling a burnout for another plane so

I am flying a bit more but I generally make about 4k per flight

so I am earning enough to stay afloat.

 

Even ordered my own custom paintscheme and I am contemplating buying a second C185 or

saving up for a Caravan or Islander which will take me approximately 1 year if I can

keep up the current rate.

 

Sofar this month flying the Skywagon I netted 129.000 dollars.

Gross was 150.000 so fuel and fees came to about 21k.

The last month I did not own my own plane yet and thus only earned 118.000 dollars net

while grossing 220.000 dollars.

The rent on the Dash 7 cost me a fortune.

 

If you pick a location with player jobs and enough planes for rent you can even make

money quickly if you fly treetop VFR with small planes.

 

cheers

 

Tom.

[Brian Sommers]

we have??

 

ok check your pm on FSE, I can get ya hooked up if you are interested.

[Kyle Ramsey 810181]

The price of airplanes in FSE is set by a formula that [Mod - Happy Thoughts]umes +75% loaded for 150 hours and you get your investment back. The payment for jobs has increased since the forumla was set so I'd say the payback is closer to 120 hours these days, provided you fly each hour at 75% or more loaded.

 

Many aspects of rw aircraft pricing can't really be replicated in FSE, like leather seats or specific avionics capabilities, geographic location (some Russian aircraft aren't certified to fly in the US but are in FSE), year of manufacture, incident records, etc. The price does change with airframe hours and there is a TBO at which you replace engines. A 30 seat airplane that flies at about the same speed and fuel burn will cost the same in FSE even if it's rw counterpart was built in the 1930's or the 2010's.

[Lee Breedlove 1196677]

The price of airplanes in FSE is set by a formula that [Mod - Happy Thoughts]umes +75% loaded for 150 hours and you get your investment back. The payment for jobs has increased since the forumla was set so I'd say the payback is closer to 120 hours these days, provided you fly each hour at 75% or more loaded.

 

Many aspects of rw aircraft pricing can't really be replicated in FSE, like leather seats or specific avionics capabilities, geographic location (some Russian aircraft aren't certified to fly in the US but are in FSE), year of manufacture, incident records, etc. The price does change with airframe hours and there is a TBO at which you replace engines. A 30 seat airplane that flies at about the same speed and fuel burn will cost the same in FSE even if it's rw counterpart was built in the 1930's or the 2010's.

 

 

I see. Well in all honesty a lot of others seem successful, so obviously it's some sort of error on my part, even with limited time. I'm going to give FSE another go, and combine my flight time there here on VATSIM. Thanks for that information though. I'm going to copy this to notepad.

[Brian Sommers]

The price of airplanes in FSE is set by a formula that [Mod - Happy Thoughts]umes +75% loaded for 150 hours and you get your investment back. The payment for jobs has increased since the forumla was set so I'd say the payback is closer to 120 hours these days, provided you fly each hour at 75% or more loaded.

 

Many aspects of rw aircraft pricing can't really be replicated in FSE, like leather seats or specific avionics capabilities, geographic location (some Russian aircraft aren't certified to fly in the US but are in FSE), year of manufacture, incident records, etc. The price does change with airframe hours and there is a TBO at which you replace engines. A 30 seat airplane that flies at about the same speed and fuel burn will cost the same in FSE even if it's rw counterpart was built in the 1930's or the 2010's.

 

 

interesting.. now the last paragraph is what someday I dream of being able to simulate in FSX or whatever.. I wish there was a way of making those little things count in flight sim.. not sure how they would have an impact in flightsim.. maybe increasing customers your way if say you have nicer seats and better avionics, .. the public would perceive it being better maintained and/or advanced charter service, even if they don't get it...

 

you would have to look at it from the real world. why put in new seats, etc and why get one type of instrument over the other.. most I would think is just pure preference and budget..

[Ernesto Alvarez 818262]

just notice Sal mentioned the New York Flying Club. unfortunately this group is pretty much on life support now. the staff have pretty much moved on in their lives and careers and can no longer maintain it. so while the site remains up, its just a glorified logbook IMO. same thing happened to virtual Flight Options and a few others, they survived for maybe a year or two on life support until the plug was finally pulled.

[Garrett Smith 1047177]

Come fly for ERA and I bet you have a skymaster in less than a month. If not I will buy it for you.

 

Its easy to make money in FSE if you like to fly, and we encourage use of Vatsim, have flights, training, and certs for our SOP.

 

www.iflyera.org

 

You dont have to fly for era, there are other groups that a pilot can do well with. dont always take the first job.