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I'd like to thank everyone who flew into Denver last night! We had an incredibly successful FNO with over 160 movements into and out of Denver International Airport. The major traffic push took place about an hour into the event. All of our controllers worked very hard to ensure this ran smoothly. Pilots, your holds were beautiful and helped us out a great bit during a small hiccup within Denver Approach airspace. You can watch the whole video below:

 

http://denartcc.org/training/Videos/FNO/2012/FNO2012.html

 

And just a reminder...we have one more event tonight!

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That was kinda neat Harold. I didn't get to fly in last night. Wish I had, now. Was I watching 16L/R Arrivals/Departures? The black screen made it hard for these tired eyes to read the radials. Looked like a lot of arrivals were sidestepping from Left to Right.

 

Randy

Randy Tyndall - KBOI

ZLA I-11/vACC Portugal P4

“A ship is always safe in the harbor. But that’s not why they build ships” --Michael Bevington ID 814931, Former VATSIM Board of Governors Vice President of Pilot Training

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Hey Randy,

 

If you look for KDEN in the center of the video, there is a set of four vertical dotted lines that mark the final approach courses for 16R, 16L, 17R, and 17L. The vertically-oriented rectangular outline that surrounds them is the airspace which Denver Final Approach (usually DEN_W_APP) owns.

 

We have a strange phenomenon at Denver where pilots get very confused as to which runway they are cleared to visually approach. Because the terminal ramp splits the western runways (34R/L) from the eastern runways (35R/L), some pilots think that because they're cleared for a visual to Runway 16L, for instance, that that runway is on the left side relative to the terminal ramp. That's the biggest cause for having to change the runways for pilots that already appear to be established on final. Of course, because we don't have a traffic management unit like the real world D01, it's hard to balance the runway load as efficiently as possible all the time, so the final approach controller will switch aircraft when necessary for spacing.

 

We can only run parallel finals between Runway 16L and Runway 16R during visual approach conditions. You wouldn't see that during an IMC weather situation.

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Hey Randy,

 

If you look for KDEN in the center of the video, there is a set of four vertical dotted lines that mark the final approach courses for 16R, 16L, 17R, and 17L. The vertically-oriented rectangular outline that surrounds them is the airspace which Denver Final Approach (usually DEN_W_APP) owns.

 

We have a strange phenomenon at Denver where pilots get very confused as to which runway they are cleared to visually approach. Because the terminal ramp splits the western runways (34R/L) from the eastern runways (35R/L), some pilots think that because they're cleared for a visual to Runway 16L, for instance, that that runway is on the left side relative to the terminal ramp. That's the biggest cause for having to change the runways for pilots that already appear to be established on final. Of course, because we don't have a traffic management unit like the real world D01, it's hard to balance the runway load as efficiently as possible all the time, so the final approach controller will switch aircraft when necessary for spacing.

 

We can only run parallel finals between Runway 16L and Runway 16R during visual approach conditions. You wouldn't see that during an IMC weather situation.

 

That strange phenomenon seems to happen everywhere there are multiple runways. Seems like it would be simple to figure out if you had an airport diagram, shame they are so hard to get.

Steven Caffey (SY) ZLA Controller

"A mile of highway gets you one mile, but a mile of runway can take you anywhere."

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Jason,

 

It's nowhere near that simple, and there are still good chances that there will be a free-to-distribute system somewhere, Many of the "web guys" who went to the Aeronav meeting in December echoed the same things, that a non-navigational free version should be available for distribution. There are still very good chances that one of the major chart suppliers (Skyvector, Airnav, Flightaware etc.) will distribute charts for free.

 

Cheers!

Rahul

Rahul Parkar

"On second thoughts Nappa, catch it, catch it with your teeth" -- Vegeta

Professional Nerd. (Professionally not professional)

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Not really sure how this turned back into the "Pay for Charts" topic, but hopefully that won't happen. Remember this:

 

http://www.ainonline.com/?q=aviation-news/ainalerts/2011-11-22/faa-digital-charting-issue-much-ado-about-nothing

 

And to be honest, I think Steven was being sarcastic on purpose when he said

shame they are so hard to get.

because they are in fact, as Steven is most likely well aware, very, very easy to get. I have six notebook binders of them that have the AD, STARs, SIDs, and Approaches all by region and then alphabetical by airport.

 

So I think two things here:

 

One, about the free charts going away we are crying that "The Sky is Falling" all over again. This was beat to death last July, and

 

Two, Steven was pointing out, by the perfect use of sarcasm, that the charts and diagrams are in fact very easy to get.

 

None of this takes away from the fact that I found this video of Harold's fascinating and entertaining and, honestly, somewhat educational.

 

Randy

Randy Tyndall - KBOI

ZLA I-11/vACC Portugal P4

“A ship is always safe in the harbor. But that’s not why they build ships” --Michael Bevington ID 814931, Former VATSIM Board of Governors Vice President of Pilot Training

1087023

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Ah...sorry Marcus...the printed word is so hard to decipher inflection. I honestly don't know why anyone would fly without charts when they are so easily found. One thing it has helped me in is understanding "directs" from ATC. I try to know my route well enough that I'll remember where on a chart something is, but every once in awhile I get cleared direct to someplace I wasn't expecting.

 

"XYZ you are cleared direct Mabel" (I honestly don't know if this waypoint even exists...I just grabbed it out of the air...hey, "out of the air"...I made a funny!)

 

Now, is that MABEL, MABLE, MABUL, MAYBL, MAIBL, etc, etc. A glance at the chart tells me instantly and I don't have to trouble ATC for the "spelling" so he or she can focus on the next guy in the progression.

Randy Tyndall - KBOI

ZLA I-11/vACC Portugal P4

“A ship is always safe in the harbor. But that’s not why they build ships” --Michael Bevington ID 814931, Former VATSIM Board of Governors Vice President of Pilot Training

1087023

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Now, is that MABEL, MABLE, MABUL, MAYBL, MAIBL, etc, etc. A glance at the chart tells me instantly and I don't have to trouble ATC for the "spelling" so he or she can focus on the next guy in the progression.

See, Randy, this is why we like when you fly in ZDV. This is what we get every day:

 

"ABC123, cross POWDR at and maintain FL190 and 250 knots."

"Roger, cross...uhh...say the fix again?"

"ABC123, Papa Oscar Whiskey Delta Romeo, as in the POWDR7 arrival that you filed. We're asking you to do what the chart says to expect from ATC."

On the chart:

POWDR
VERTICAL NAVIGATION PLANNING INFORMATION
TURBOJETS: Expect to cross at FL190 and 250 KIAS or as [Mod - Happy Thoughts]igned by ATC.

 

A little bit of planning saves us a lot of time .

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