Biggin Hill

[patrick MOUQUET 1251779]

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Edited November 2, 2014 at 08:38 PM by Guest

[Michael Pike]

Radar vectoring is not restricted to controlled airspace. In Cl[Mod - Happy Thoughts] G it is carried out at the request of the pilot under a Traffic Service or Deconfliction Service. The floor of the Cl[Mod - Happy Thoughts] A London TMA is at 2500ft so any airways traffic would begin receiving vectors under Radar Control Service.

 

A very perceptive question you asked! Perhaps a Thames controller will be along in a minute with more detail.

[patrick MOUQUET 1251779]

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Edited November 2, 2014 at 08:39 PM by Guest

[Kieran Hardern]

... except CTA cl[Mod - Happy Thoughts] D (2500/1500) of London City.

Does it mean that radar vectoring for LOC rwy 21 should take place only in this area ? Is it right ?

That's correct. Thames handles the approach radar for both LC and KB, so using the LC airspace isn't a problem. KB arrivals come in from the east (often near the bottom of the CTA) and get kept inside controlled airspace for as long as possible. The descent to 1800ft happens when they enter the LC CTR and they leave controlled airspace when established or just about to.

 

 

...to be established not later than I-BGH DME 5."

This in itself makes it difficult to do anything other than use the LC airspace.

 

The LC CTA is only just over 5.5 DME on the KB ILS anyway. You can't go under the CTA outside of CAS as then you are below minimum safe altitudes to provide vectoring. Trying to fit them outside of CAS to the south (at 1800ft) wouldn't work for anything but the slow aircraft with tiny turning circles as otherwise there isn't enough room to get them on the ILS before 5 DME.

[patrick MOUQUET 1251779]

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Edited November 2, 2014 at 08:39 PM by Guest

[Johan Grauers]

Hello Kieran,

 

Yes indeed, controlled airspace (CTA cl[Mod - Happy Thoughts] D 2500/1500) is not so far when providing vectors for LOC rwy 21 at 1800ft. We should be inside.

 

In UK what is the minimum distance that controller using vectoring should apply in order to position an aircraft on LOC before commencing descent on the glide path (except for CDA operation) ?

I did not find the answer in the CAP493 docomeent.

In France it is not a distance but a time value: 30 seconds minimum before FAF/FAP established on axis (localizer for ILS or LOC approach) and in a stabilised level flight according to the FAF/FAP altitude (available for precision or non-precision approaches, except CDA operation and GCA operation).

 

It varies, usually a distance is specified in the mats part 2 however I think there's a paragraph in the part 1 somewhere that says no closer than 5 miles from touchdown for a jet aircraft on an ILS approach.

 

Also the last bit sounds like a CDA which in the UK allows for 2 miles of level flight.