ANVIL Waypoint on AIRNAV Chart Out of Place

[Randy Tyndall 1087023]

Anybody besides me notice that on the AIRNAV chart download for the ILS CatIII Approach to 16C at KSEA the ANVIL Waypoint is correctly displayed on the lateral depiction of the approach, but on the vertical depiction of the approach it is grossly out of place?

 

 

Although the DME is listed correctly, the vertical portion shows ANVIL between SODOE and the runway, when it is (as the DME value shows) between MGNUM and SODOE actually.

 

I would [Mod - Happy Thoughts]ume the FAA would catch something like this if the download comes from a real world source. I noticed on the Navigraph Jeppesen Charts this is depicted correctly, but the links from Flightaware and Skyvector also show ANVIL "out of place".

 

The ILS CatI and II chart shows everything correctly as does the ILS chart. Only the ILS CatIII chart is "wrong".

 

And that is why we don't use these charts for real world navigation.

 

Randy

[Bradley Grafelman]

I would [Mod - Happy Thoughts]ume the FAA would catch something like this

Heh... sometimes I wish the pure volume of discrepancies, missing/malformed data, etc. that gets reported to and corrected by the FAA/Jepp on a regular basis was tracked/charted somewhere. I think many people's response would be a mixture of and . Heck, just last month, I was playing around with their XML metadata source for the chart publications (d-TPP) and kept getting SQL errors about failed unique constraints. After questioning everything from my code to my DB structure, I finally scanned through the XML file and found the problem was with the data itself. A couple of exchanged e-mails and one safety alert later, all was well.

 

As for this fun little gem you've found... looks like it was the same back in the 1711 charts, too. I guess this procedure just doesn't get used all that often?

 

EDIT: By the way, that's not an "AirNav" chart... go up to the URL bar at the top there and erase everything after the first '/' so you're just left with http://155.178.201.160 so you can see who the author is.

[Randy Tyndall 1087023]

so you can see who the author is.

 

Well, I'll be.

 

"Uh, Mr. FAA Chart guy...I have a number for you to call...let me know when you are ready to copy."

 

I also played around with the XML metadata source for the chart publications (d-TPP) download but found it took forever to download the three or four different files and finding a chart in them was so difficult for me it was next to impossible, so I gave up using it.

 

Randy

[Don Desfosse]

I have the FAA Charting office on speed dial. I'll send it in. Expect a NOTAM tomorrow. Thanks.

[Andreas Fuchs]

That happens. Years ago one of our members in Germany found a discrepancy in waypoints at EDDS/Stuttgart and the real air traffic control service provider had to suspend and re-code that procedure.

[Robert Shearman Jr]

I think it's safe to say that ANVIL got dropped...

[Andreas Fuchs]

I don't think so. The latest revision on my Jeppesen charts is dated 06OCT2017 and ANVIL is still depicted at D10.3.

[Don Desfosse]

Forgot to post when it was first published....

 

!FDC 7/1492 SEA CHART SEATTLE-TACOMA INTL, Seattle, WA.

ILS RWY 16C (CAT II & III), AMDT 16A ...

CORRECT PROFILE: SWAP SODOE AND ANVIL TEXT. SODOE I-SZI 6.2 DME RADAR SHOULD BE 4.4 NM FROM THRESHOLD AND ANVIL I-SZI 10.3 DME RADAR SHOULD BE 8.5 NM FROM THRESHOLD 1711211845-PERM

 

Nice job. You'd be surprised how many of these VATUSA/VATSIM members find and get reported. I think we should be on commission

[Don Desfosse]

I don't think so. The latest revision on my Jeppesen charts is dated 06OCT2017 and ANVIL is still depicted at D10.3.

 

Andreas, do me a favor -- are you seeing that on a Jepp chart effective 06OCT2017 for the ILS 16C CAT II?

 

The reason I ask is, I was focused on the FAA chart, and never looked at the Jepp chart, but right now I don't even show the ILS 16C CAT II even in existence on Jepp. Strange! Wondering if it's just me (I primarily use FAA, not Jepp)?

[Andreas Fuchs]

Yes, Jepp got 16C CAT II & III dated 06OCT2017 with ANVIL at the correct location.

[Don Desfosse]

OK, thanks.

[Sebastien Bartosz]

(A3469/17 NOTAMN

A) KSEA

B) 1711211845

C) PERM

E) ILS RWY 16C (CAT II III), AMDT 16A ...

CORRECT PROFILE: SWAP SODOE AND ANVIL TEXT. SODOE I-SZI 6.2 DME

RADAR SHOULD BE 4.4 NM FROM THRESHOLD AND ANVIL I-SZI 10.3 DME

RADAR SHOULD BE 8.5 NM FROM THRESHOLD

)

DECODE - QXXXX - SEE TEXT OF NOTAM

- SEE TEXT OF NOTAM

[Randy Tyndall 1087023]

Wow, Don, I honestly thought you were kidding when you said you had the FAA Chart Section on speed dial.

 

Just went to the docs and read the NOTAM.

 

Kinda hard to fathom that my post resulted in that, yet you said we would be surprised how often it happens.

 

Guess this is my 15 seconds of anonymous fame...

 

Randy

[Don Desfosse]

Nope, I was serious, although nowadays instead of calling I send an email. Thank you for helping the many hundreds of pilots, and tens of thousands of p[Mod - Happy Thoughts]engers, flying into KSEA, and for your important contribution to air safety in the United States! Great job! (and now another story for the grandkids!)