Bo Gercke 845743 Posted May 29, 2006 at 09:42 PM Posted May 29, 2006 at 09:42 PM Just wanted to put the feelers out there to see if any of you guys from the Phoenix area had any interest in doing a tour of PHX or Luke AFB tower and approach facilities. I'll be home from June 9th until early July. I don't have dates, but if you all are available, or have interest, I'll get some dates and we'll go have a peek. Let me know via email, or reply via PM with some contact info. Oh yeah... email... bgercke1(AT)hotmail(DoT)comm (remove an M) Muchos Gracias..... The GX VATSIM Blog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isaac Niedrauer 947516 Posted May 29, 2006 at 09:52 PM Posted May 29, 2006 at 09:52 PM (edited) I would suggest that you try contacting a local (PHX) CAP squadron. There is no doubt in my mind they would want to. Edited May 29, 2006 at 09:55 PM by Guest Clear Skies, Isaac Niedrauer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bo Gercke 845743 Posted May 29, 2006 at 09:55 PM Author Posted May 29, 2006 at 09:55 PM Isaac, I'm not interested in giving a CAP squadron a tour. i'm interested in giving the guys here at VATSIM a look at how it REALLY works in the real world if they haven't seen it. Something about giving a little bit back to those who have given to me... The GX VATSIM Blog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isaac Niedrauer 947516 Posted May 29, 2006 at 09:56 PM Posted May 29, 2006 at 09:56 PM Isaac, I'm not interested in giving a CAP squadron a tour. i'm interested in giving the guys here at VATSIM a look at how it REALLY works in the real world if they haven't seen it. Something about giving a little bit back to those who have given to me... Oh, I understand. I would be interested if I didn't live 500 miles away. Clear Skies, Isaac Niedrauer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Tribolet 897448 Posted May 30, 2006 at 02:05 AM Posted May 30, 2006 at 02:05 AM Isaac, I'm not interested in giving a CAP squadron a tour. i'm interested in giving the guys here at VATSIM a look at how it REALLY works in the real world if they haven't seen it. Something about giving a little bit back to those who have given to me... Oh, I understand. I would be interested if I didn't live 500 miles away. About 1,000 acutally. Max Tribolet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nate Johns Posted May 30, 2006 at 08:52 AM Posted May 30, 2006 at 08:52 AM Just because you can't make it to PHX for Bo's kindly arranged tour action doesn't mean you can't make it happen yourself at a facility near you. Check out: http://www.atccti.com/docomeent/phone.pdf These are direct lines to the ATM, their secretary, or other designee for the facilities listed (a pretty comprehensive list to boot). As long as you're genuine in your interest in ATC (from either a pilot or controller perspective), "of age" (too young usually gets you a pretty abbreviated hi-and-goodbye tour, even if super-interested), very kind and respectful, and possibly a little flexible about date and/or times, tours shouldn't be too terribly difficult to make happen. Going by yourself usually affords you the best experience, with exceptions of course. By no means are there guaranteed yesses, but don't [Mod - Happy Thoughts]ume facilities are off limits. It just takes some guts to make the phone call, and possibly a little perserverance. ~Nate Nate Johns "All things are difficult before they are easy." - Dr. Thomas Fuller, Gnomologia, 1732 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Hjemvick 811983 Posted May 30, 2006 at 01:20 PM Posted May 30, 2006 at 01:20 PM I'd also find out who the NATCA Fac Rep is and talk to them. NATCA loves giving tours, and is usually less beaurocratic about it than a training administrator or other stooge. CMEL.CSEL.IA.AGI.CFI.CFII.MEI.CRJ2.FO.Furloughed Part of the Acey 80 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nate Johns Posted May 30, 2006 at 04:02 PM Posted May 30, 2006 at 04:02 PM Excellent point. If there was ever a night-and-day difference in how a facility tour goes on the plesantness scale, it's the difference between being under a training department manager, or a NATCA member. ~Nate Nate Johns "All things are difficult before they are easy." - Dr. Thomas Fuller, Gnomologia, 1732 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isaac Niedrauer 947516 Posted May 30, 2006 at 04:26 PM Posted May 30, 2006 at 04:26 PM I thought tours like that were no longer allowed post-9/11. Clear Skies, Isaac Niedrauer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Brummett Posted May 30, 2006 at 04:39 PM Posted May 30, 2006 at 04:39 PM I thought tours like that were no longer allowed post-9/11. If that were the case, I'm wondering how the raffle to take a tour of ZAU during the VATUSA convention got going? I do know that tours are allowed, but you need to know somebody (I took a tour of Tulsa tower/TRACON post 9/11 with about two weeks advance notice). Mark Brummett Website owner, http://www.zkcartcc.org ZKC Events Co-ordinator Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nate Johns Posted May 30, 2006 at 04:57 PM Posted May 30, 2006 at 04:57 PM I thought tours like that were no longer allowed post-9/11. Since 9/11, I have been in 3 different en-route centers, multiple times (these are the toughest to get in to as well), 5 towers (2 Cl[Mod - Happy Thoughts] B), and 2 major TRACONs. I can [Mod - Happy Thoughts]ure you tours still go on Heck, I just visited P50 and PHX in March, both with calls straight to the facility, and about 24 hours notice. The thing is this... while I try to have a never-say-never attitude about this stuff, you generally can't be some joe-schmoe from off the street who wants to watch the planes fly around, or see the targets on the scope move. If you do manage to get a tour, and come off as just a gawker, don't expect much. You need to have at least a basic reason for being there; whether it be a pilot learning the local airspace, a CTI student wanting to get out of the cl[Mod - Happy Thoughts]room to see something real, or even just someone who's (again, genuinely) interested in entering the profession, and would like an idea whether the environment suits them. Once you're on the floor or in the cab, ask questions of the controllers. Most controllers LOVE their job, and are more than happy to answer your likely neverending stream of "what's this" or "why did you do that" questions. Of course, don't be buggy about it, and always shut your mouth when they are listining or talking on the frequency (concentration and a hot, recorded, tapes-quickly-pullable mic among other things). ATC needs people, and, as mentioned by Josh, if you can get a hold of a NATCA rep, especially if facility management denies you initially, well... put it this way, NATCA is pro-staffing, and enjoys showing around prospective hires. ~Nate Nate Johns "All things are difficult before they are easy." - Dr. Thomas Fuller, Gnomologia, 1732 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Long Posted May 30, 2006 at 05:25 PM Posted May 30, 2006 at 05:25 PM I had called Greensboro ATCT/TRACON a bit ago, the first person I talked to said it'd be a bad day and to call back later and talk to this one guy, I called back, and he ended up turning me down, saying it was only open to PPLs. P.S. I vote for a split topic.... one for Bos offer, and one on getting facility tours.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nate Johns Posted May 30, 2006 at 06:05 PM Posted May 30, 2006 at 06:05 PM Things vary from facility to facility... but the PPL only thing is c r a p, I'm here to tell you. Heck, why shouldn't a student pilot be able to get in? They would need it more than a full PPL. If it wasn't the NATCA rep you spoke with already, call back in a couple days and ask for the NATCA rep. Don't leave messages, don't accept anyone else. Talk live with him (sometimes it takes a few tries, since they work traffic too, and have other business to attend to as well). If the NATCA facility rep turns you down, then let it be for a couple months, then try again. Persistence pays off, bar none. Creative wording can help get a tour. Don't lie, heck no don't lie... but don't undermine yourself and your chances by downplaying your interest, or that you have a genuine reason for wanting to visit. ~Nate PS - This system filters the word "cr@p?" Now that's a little too much! Nate Johns "All things are difficult before they are easy." - Dr. Thomas Fuller, Gnomologia, 1732 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicholas Bartolotta 912967 Posted May 30, 2006 at 06:56 PM Posted May 30, 2006 at 06:56 PM Thanks for this info Nate, I'm clearing up my schedule for a visit to BDR sometime soon Nick Bartolotta - ZSE Instructor, pilot at large "Just fly it on down to within a inch of the runway and let it drop in from there." - Capt. Don Lanham, ATA Airlines Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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