Feature request: mute AfV

[Martijn Rammeloo]

I think it would be a great feature to have a mute-button in the AvF client. As a controller, I 'sometimes' need to coordinate via Discord, and muting pilots for a short time would make this process a lot easier.

Martijn

 

 

[Ross Carlson]

I think it would be too easy to accidentally leave it muted without realizing it. Happens all the time in TeamSpeak. Maybe if it had a big flashing red warning when it was muted. 

Some real facilities have a way to automatically route pilot audio to a speaker when they're on a landline call with another controller on their headset. Having something like that would be nice. You could route the pilot audio to one ear while controller audio is in the other ear, or route pilot audio to your speakers while controller audio is in the headset. This would obviously require that AFV is used for the controller coordination calls, but AFAIK that's planned for the future.

Edited December 27, 2020 at 04:55 PM by Ross Carlson

[Martijn Rammeloo]

I am aware of the risks, but to be honest, at times when I need this feature, a 10-15 second silence would raise enough suspicion to check if there's something wrong with the audio.

Some time ago, I experimented with a Virtual Audio Cable in order to achieve the same result. Although it worked OK, the setup was a hassle: plugging my headset in a different USB port forced me to do the setup again.

A left/right solution would be good for me as well, but routing audio to my speakers would make my wife less-than-happy :-). Until then, a simple mute button would be the quickest solution.

 

 

[Robert Shearman Jr]

Maybe to avoid leaving it muted, make it automatically un-mute after 15 seconds? 

[Ross Carlson]

3 hours ago, Martijn Rammeloo said:

at times when I need this feature, a 10-15 second silence would raise enough suspicion to check if there's something wrong

By then, the damage is already done.

25 minutes ago, Robert Shearman Jr said:

Maybe to avoid leaving it muted, make it automatically un-mute after 15 seconds? 

I considered that before I made my original reply, but you can miss a lot in 15 seconds. And not all coordination calls are completed in 15 seconds. Really, any value we could choose would be arbitrary.

The only way I'd be in favor of such a feature is if it was not subject to the user forgetting about it. I don't want to be flying on VATSIM and wondering if the controller forgot to unmute his frequency if he's not responding. I can see it now ... impatient pilots sending "DOOD UNMUTE YOUR FREQ" on text if the controller doesn't respond right away. 

[Martijn Rammeloo]

Hi Ross, 

I see your point, but missing both a pilot call and a coordination message at the same times causes more damage in my opinion. That is my use-case after all: when an APP controller wants to talk to me on a CTR position, it MUST be important and urgent.

If coordination would take longer (hardly ever...) I could simply press the mute-button again.

I think that the '15 seconds solutions' is a great idea. That would prevent users forgetting to unmute. So, if a pilot doesn't get a response, he can be assured that there is a real reason for it.

Suggestion: a small scale test?

(Obviously I can simply unselect 'RX' on my frequency, but I feel that reconnecting takes a bit more time than simply unmuting)

Cheers, Martijn

 

 

 

 

 

[Ross Carlson]

11 hours ago, Martijn Rammeloo said:

I see your point, but missing both a pilot call and a coordination message at the same times causes more damage in my opinion. That is my use-case after all: when an APP controller wants to talk to me on a CTR position, it MUST be important and urgent.

I agree, but a solution that introduces a new problem is not a solution at all, in my book. That's just trading one issue for another.

A proper solution would be something that automatically mutes/unmutes, or re-routes the pilot audio to a different ear or different audio device (there's a reason why this is how it works in the real world). The operative word is automatically ... it can't rely on faulty human memory.

 

[Gary Oliver]

Audio routing is in the pipeline for future releases... 

[Dustin Rider]

21 hours ago, Gary Oliver said:

Audio routing is in the pipeline for future releases... 

This is great news. Thank you for the update, Gary. 

[Joel Richters]

Ross, what about a deafen button so it can be held but as soon as you let the button go it will be unmuted. 

[Dustin Rider]

Audio routing is a much, much higher priority to me. Muting, which is technically not allowed since our beloved 7110.65 says ATC must maintain constant watch on our assigned frequencies, would become irrelevant if I were able to send A/G radio traffic over my loudspeaker with the click of one button. 

And Gary, if you still happen to be checking this forum, may I reiterate a clarification of this particular audio-routing feature request? It would be most useful if there was a way to route all audio (with one button) in addition to routing individual frequencies to loudspeaker or headset. 

[Andreas Fuchs]

1 hour ago, Dustin Rider said:

Muting, which is technically not allowed since our beloved 7110.65 says ATC must maintain constant watch on our assigned frequencies

Oh yes, you may mute your frequency when in oceanic airspace, saves you from having to listen to all those POS REPs. If ATC needs your attention they will SELCAL you.

[Ross Carlson]

8 hours ago, Joel Richters 891193 said:

Ross, what about a deafen button so it can be held but as soon as you let the button go it will be unmuted. 

I'm not sure how well that would work. Consider that sometimes the controller needs to be typing and/or moving the mouse while on the coordination call.

My opinion is that we need to wait for proper simulation of how it's done in the real world, and that means audio routing in AFV. We've survived without it this long, we can wait a little longer. 

Edited February 4, 2021 at 05:36 PM by Ross Carlson

[Robert Shearman Jr]

3 hours ago, Andreas Fuchs said:

Oh yes, you may mute your frequency when in oceanic airspace, saves you from having to listen to all those POS REPs. If ATC needs your attention they will SELCAL you.

Dustin's comment was about controllers, not pilots, being mandated to maintain constant watch.  (7110.65 is essentially the US ATC bible.)

[Andreas Fuchs]

Oh damn, thanks for pointing this out.

[Jake Saw]

Our voice switch in real life routes air-ground audio (plus other ground-ground audio) at a reduced volume down any open landlines so that the other end of the call can hear your aircraft transmitting and either shut up, talk in between transmissions or at least know that they're talking over someone else.

vatSys already allows easy toggling of Speaker / Headset for air-ground.

[Dustin Rider]

11 hours ago, Ross Carlson said:

I'm not sure how well that would work. Consider that sometimes the controller needs to be typing and/or moving the mouse while on the coordination call.

My opinion is that we need to wait for proper simulation of how it's done in the real world, and that means audio routing in AFV. We've survived without it this long, we can wait a little longer. 

Agreed. Ideally, I would like to have A/G and G/G communications handled by the same application for auto-routing capability as well as more efficient controller-to-controller coordination. As much as I appreciate Discord and Teamspeak for intra-ARTCC coordination, I'd really like some kind of landline capability with my neighbors, with most of which I have no TS or Discord permissions. I like coordinating by text about as much as I like controlling with text--and I don't like controlling with text. 

[Joel Richters]

On 2/5/2021 at 10:11 AM, Jake Saw said:

Our voice switch in real life routes air-ground audio (plus other ground-ground audio) at a reduced volume down any open landlines so that the other end of the call can hear your aircraft transmitting and either shut up, talk in between transmissions or at least know that they're talking over someone else.

vatSys already allows easy toggling of Speaker / Headset for air-ground.

Ross, this ability in vPilot would be great. To be able to toggle between Headset and Speaker. That way when you get up from your computer you can switch it over to speaker and be able to monitor ATC still?