Finally transitioned to a Windows 7 Sim

[Ryan Renz]

Well, I purchased a used pc last week (not that I can afford it...), took me about 4 days to get it all booted up and configured, got fs all installed.  The system is actually spec'd better than my main system (dual boot Workstation/ Gaming machine). I was actually getting pretty excited, because I had initially considered triple booting my primary machine and using it for my simulator as well; however I figured I didn't need anything this powerful.  So when I actually sat down and looked at the specifications, I realized this other system is fairly comparable/ actually slightly better.

 

I gave a thought to sending my system over to the simulator and using this newer system as my primary computer, however that would be an extensive amount of work and I'm still satisfied with the operation on my system, so I figured, use the clean slate as the Sim, and keep everything else the same; probably save me 2/3 the workload. 

 

Anyhow, that's the preface, but then the bubble got deflated... see, I was all convinced that this new system was going to be an absolute monster, far more than Microsoft could ever touch.  Well I booted fs and actually, was nothing short of disappointed... it's like the new system didn't even fix anything.  I mean I have been running fs2004 essentially ever since it came out.  I still have the original box and price tag from when I bought it off the shelf from (Compu Smart - I think it was), along with my CH rudder pedals and yoke.  Back then I was running it on my "top of the line" gaming laptop, which struggled to run it on one and two screens.  Over the years I built my cockpit and added hardware, eventually a few years back, an old friend gave me his old gaming desktop so I made the transition; and have been flying that way ever since, until now that is. 

 

Anyways, as my computers got better I added components and increased the settings, it always worked fairly well but flying online with VATSIM, traffic, all the connected users, scenery, and everything else; the flight sim ran anywhere from barely flyable pong type gaming to, actually pretty good and usable.  So needless to say with all the banter online I figured, upgraded 64 bit architecture, high end processor, virtually unlimited ram, superior graphics processing.... this thing is like a super computer meets Tetris.  However it seems Microsoft was holding back punches... the simulator still struggles with low frame rates, occasional random system crashes/ freezing... all the same old same old.  I realize the game is still based on 32 bit architecture, it wasn't reprogrammed to use modern multicore processors and powerful gpus; as well as high volumes of high speed ram........... but come on!  You're telling me that somehow the programmers at Microsoft back in the 2000's wrote some gaming software that will outclass computers even over a decade newer (we're talking 2003 era to 2018); can no system actually run this program properly?

 

How are systems actually supposed to run the new fs2020; I mean that whole game is so realistic it looks like 100% photoreal, and lifelike.  I don't know, perhaps I'm just doing something all wrong.  I've recently looked at newer tweaking guides and made some changes to the .cfg file; but I didn't notice any differences.  Everyone says it looks so much better and runs so much better than ever... as to me, it looks EXACTLY the same and operates very similar. 

 

Looking for the problem, the CPU usage is anywhere from 70-100% on the first core, and my graphics card only seems to be operating at 25%.  I'm using nVidia to run all my anti aliasing, filtering etc; mostly everything is set to maximum (I used to run all my settings at maximum on my other system, but never though to have nVidia run the settings vs fs, si that's a change).

 

Any who.  It's nice to have a new dedicated system, dual boot for gaming and fs.  It's tiring changing video cards and configurations on my main system when I just want to do an afternoon of gaming; so this will be a nice benefit of another system.  I'm considering the option that I have some sort of fault in a scenery file; although since the crashing/ freezing is completely random... I don't know.  It's thing to take an exorbitant amount of time to go through each one by one and troubleshoot/ test each addon to find if it's the culprit.  But I have my new Ruscool RNS530 hardware all working with the RealityXP GNS530 software, I installed the new SPAD drivers, I'm writing Lua scripts and running them through fsuipc... I think I'm a few steps ahead. 

 

I plan to hopefully get this cockpit finished this year, so if ever it's completed I will post photos... I think there are some floating around if what it once looked like... it's come a long way from a yoke in front of a laptop. 

 

Keep the sunny side up!

 

P.S. I did perform the "4gb/ Large Address Aware" patch, valid fs9.1, running as administrator.

Edited April 1, 2022 at 05:09 AM by Ryan Renz
error correction

[Andrew Crowley]

If I'm understanding correctly that you're running FS2004 and asking how computers can run MSFS, the answer is that MSFS is modern software written on a modern engine for modern hardware. 

Remember that FS2004 is incapable of using more than a few gigs of memory for instance, no matter how much you have. 

MSFS is actually less performance intensive at reasonable settings than the old sims are.

[Ryan Renz]

Well, yes, but more so; well, it's complicated to explain.  Like every time a game developer comes out with a new program it's always a strain on modern tech (hardware).  You have to wait many years for hardware to get good enough to run the software program (game); but by then the software is obsolete.

 

So I think of it as you are always behind, you never catch up or even get ahead.  So do developers just create these programs that can never be run properly no matter what?  Or is there some magical system that works properly.  How do they even test it themselves unless they have some crazy super computer?!

 

Even now I'm running fs2004, which was essentially 2003 technology, on a fairly high tech computer system from circa 2015.  That means the hardware and OS technology is over a decade newer but it still struggles.  Maybe it's just me but I expected it to operate flawlessly.  So it's just like what's the point.

 

I don't know.  I just don't understand it all.  You'd think technology would be simple.  By the best components available, wait a long as you can for the newest and best; but then you do and it's still not perfect.  So you kinda just wasted your money and time.  As much as I know about technology it seems I know nothing.

[Robert Shearman Jr]

Technology is far from simple, and unfortunately the logic of the way you wish it worked is only true if newer computers do things in the same exact way as older computers, only faster.  And that's not the case.  Computer processors circa 2015 do a lot more with multi-core threading and offloading certain processes to the graphics card, that computers in 2003 did not do and the software that was designed for them is not set up to take advantage of.

If you have a PC from circa 2015, you might consider trying X-Plane 11.  I'm not sure what your graphic specs are, but if you have something reasonably compatible with OpenGL or Vulkan it might give you performance and visuals more akin to what you are hoping for.

The PC I bought in 2020 was not top-of-the-line, but it was close -- and it runs MSFS2020 splendidly.  The simple fact is that if you want modern software to run well and look great, you need modern hardware.   When you're using hardware that's seven years outdated, it's just not going to keep up.  No way around it, really.  When it comes to PC specs you get what you pay for.

[Ryan Renz]

So what is the best possible specification for fs2004?

 

If I upgraded the simulator it would be to fs20, it looks like real life, but thank you for the suggestion anyway.

 

If I have money 5 years from now maybe I'll buy a brand new computer and fs20 and do a full upgrade, thank you for your input.

[Lauri Uusitalo]

Windows 7, online?

[Alexandra Robison]

Running Windows 7 connected to the internet is a BAD idea - it is EOL software and doesn't get any security updates anymore.

[Ryan Renz]

I'm not concerned.  That's what backups are for.

 

But thank you!

[Andrew Crowley]

I truly would try MSFS2020 on this new computer. I'll bet, with the graphics settings and options cranked down to low, this sim will still both look a lot better and run a lot better than fs2004.

There's a way to try it very cheaply on Steam (buy a game pass I think? I'm on Store version so can't help there)... but I think it equaled being able to try MSFS for a month for like $2.  Maybe this was some kind of promotion though; someone more familiar than me will have to chime in.

But it really is worth trying the modern sim, for performance reasons as well as cosmetic ones. 

[Ryan Renz]

hm.

 

I fear disappointment.  This system is far older than the new game...

but I value your input, and trust your judgement.  Perhaps I'll consider looking into that.

[Andrew Crowley]

Hm also. I'm not a computer or gaming expert either so maybe I'm wrong.  I never tried MSFS on my old computer (that ran FSX *all right*), but a friend had to convince me to try DCS on it.  I was positive that since it was a much newer and much more complex game / simulator, it would be a slideshow.  Turned out I got almost double the FPS in DCS that I did in FSX, and it looked good. 

So yes, hopefully someone who IS an expert can chime in... but I wouldn't write it off without trying! 

[Tobias Dammers]

14 hours ago, Ryan Renz said:

I'm not concerned.  That's what backups are for.

 

But thank you!

Someone deleting your data is not what you should be concerned about. That's indeed easy to mitigate.

More pressing concerns are people reading your passwords, credit card info, personal data, etc., and then proceed to clearing out your bank account, taking over your email, maxing out your credit card, identity theft, using your computer as a mount point for attacks against other targets ("zombie"), eavesdropping on your microphone and webcam, planting fake evidence in order to extort you, stuff like that. These things are much harder to mitigate, and you might not even notice when they happen.

[Ryan Renz]

Fortunately that cannot be done on my computers.  😉👌

[Alexandra Robison]

On 5/16/2022 at 4:57 AM, Ryan Renz said:

Fortunately that cannot be done on my computers.  😉👌

If that is truly the case, you could make a lot of money being a cybersecurity consultant for companies that don't want to transition away from W7. Then you could buy whatever caliber system is necessary to run FS2020...

[Ryan Renz]

Hahaha.

 

I wish; unfortunately people want to put all that information out there; so you can't stop stupid.

 

My simulator does one thing and one thing only.  (Well two technically,  if you group all the connecting to VATSIM as the second)

 

Besides.  Even if I had something to steal, or pirate... I'm still not a worthy target; so go ahead.

 

Lack of security isn't a good defense.  Being undesirable however is the best possible!  People just make themselves an easy target.  There's my free anti-hack advice.  Don't bank.  Don't have friends.  Don't use credit cards.  Go to a real place physically, or call a place via telephone; those are generally safer options.  Heck, if you truly want to be safe... don't use the internet.  I don't even have internet at home; I fly VATSIM via my cellular telephone... two routers... and if you're truly Anal, you could setup a sacrificial dummy system firewall and hide the rest of your network behind it on a VPN server system.

 

Lastly, don't tell anyone your configuration.  Like how I have one computer setup as my FS.  Another as my Workstation, another as a gaming system (actually 2x gaming systems), another older general use system, tablet, multiple cellular telephones, 5 NAS systems, and three other towers that are essentially paper weights... but those could easily be hardware firewall/VPN sacrificial systems if I was even remotely concerned.

 

I don't do online banking, I don't social network, I don't use my real information (save for VATSIM), I don't save any information for convenience, and I have nothing of value.

 

If you're truly paranoid of internet security I suggest Linux... but hay, what do I know; all I took was a Comtech course in High School.  Back when I was in school and the internet was invented they warned us about sharing information online... I think I'm the only person who ever listened and to this day follow that religiously.  I've had people call me out in forums before; sharing my "personal" information with the public forum because they had a beef about me.  I just laugh when they post my name, and my address and none of it is real,  but they are so full of themselves like they are Sherlock Holmes with all the facts.  If you actuality looked at my life long online history, you'd be hard pressed to even sort out my real birth date.  Let alone anything that actually matters.

 

Unfortunately VATSIM won't let me lie... so you all have access to my real name.  Ruin my credit score if you think you can profit from it, all the power to you.

 

*shrugs*

[Lauri Uusitalo]

Seems like you have all sorted out, good for you. And I am almost certain that people on VATSIM are not interested in you.

Quote

I don't do online banking, I don't social network, I don't use my real information (save for VATSIM), I don't save any information for convenience, and I have nothing of value.

I would assume that even in Canada, the bank facilities are more and more in decline, and online banking is (almost) the only way to do things. And to be fair more convenient in most cases. Also ordering anything over mail is quite difficult without real name and address.

But good for you.

[Ryan Renz]

Actually I personally haven't noticed a decline in banks.  Quite to the contrary actuality.  I've even gone to banks now that are "Cyber" banks.  There no teller or vault, just a bunch of office bankers that setup your accounts and give you financial advice I suppose; not sure what they do exactly.

 

Any matter, I don't need to go to a bank anyways.  With direct deposit paychecks, and I rarely ever use cash; debit card at the till is what I use.  I also don't use tap payments.  All my transactions must be verified with a very simple pin that anyone could guess.

 

I appreciate all the advice, but I have no stress about my setup.  Glad that we are all sharing information however; if per se I was not aware of that I would appreciate the security advice.  So thank you for sharing and keeping us all safe.