Suggestion - Automated real world ATIS when ATC is offline

[Tim Wells]

Many of us on VATSIM are trying to simulate real-world operations.  For example, using the same runway they are using in the real world.

When ATC is offline, I use the real world D-ATIS from https://datis.clowd.io/ for major US airports.  You can also listen to the real world ATIS for some airports at https://www.liveatc.net/.  Another option is to use a flight radar website like https://flightradar24.com/, and watch the live traffic to identify the flow of the airport.  Another resource is https://metar-taf.com/ that visually shows you the wind direction for each runway, making it easy to select the runway with the most favorable wind direction.

I have an idea, what if we could access the real-world ATIS in VATSIM when ATC is offline.  It should only be when ATC is offline, and should be precluded with text that identifies it as a real-world ATIS.  This would make it easier for pilots to find the real world ATIS, and choose an appropriate runway.

I was recently at large airport where ATC was offline and a pilot was taking off on a runway facing east, while the airport was west. Another pilot and I tried to inform him that he was taking off in the wrong direction and may be headed towards landing traffic, but he went anyway.

If there is a better place to post suggestions, let me know.

[Torben Andersen]

The question is wether or not it resolves any problem. IRL there are a number of factors determining rwy in use (wind direction, time of day, spread of noise equally between the surrounding areas, safety etc). In my experience vatsim pilots rarely looks at RW ops when flying - I know I don't, as I have no internet pc in my hardware cockpit, so I can't check online. I rely in the weather forecast and the pilots in the area announcing their intentions. Most times I land on the rwy most into the wind, but traffic might pursuade me otherwise. An additional problem is, what weather source is being used differs and vatsim weather is not always the same as real weather due to lack in the system. Who can tell, what the right directions is then? Even if they land at EKCH rwy 04L IRL, if my weather has a strong wind in the opposite direction, I'll land on rwy 22L, eventually via a hold to let traffic departing/landing 04L get out of the way.

BTW I allways use Vatsim weather, as if a controler pops up, he'll also use it.

[Kirk Christie]

13 hours ago, Tim Wells said:

I was recently at large airport where ATC was offline and a pilot was taking off on a runway facing east, while the airport was west. Another pilot and I tried to inform him that he was taking off in the wrong direction and may be headed towards landing traffic, but he went anyway.

This comes up alot. Uncontrolled airfields you can land and depart whatever direction you want, I see it heaps at regional remote airports where the terminal is at one end of the runway and this reduces the need to back track. Also, plenty if airports run reciprocal runway operations even when controlled. This could be because of terrain or noise abaitment procedures.

First off, It is important to note that this is not wrong. But private messaging some one could be considered pestering, so be careful, under the COC pilots are not allowed to issue ATC instructions at any time to anyone.

Second, as long as people are communicating and you follow the rules of the air, landing has priority over departing, if you have to wait at the holding point while some one takes off from the other end of the runway, I am unsure of what the big deal is? Lack of patience? They are not doing what I am doing so I'm annoyed? They are being unrealistic so I'm annoyed? 

Will it hurt your online experience to give way to some one for a couple of minutes? Or do we always have to be in this state of I'm ready to go and I want to go now?

[Lauri Uusitalo]

17 hours ago, Tim Wells said:

I have an idea, what if we could access the real-world ATIS in VATSIM when ATC is offline.  It should only be when ATC is offline, and should be precluded with text that identifies it as a real-world ATIS.  This would make it easier for pilots to find the real world ATIS, and choose an appropriate runway.

Not all (smaller) airports have ATIS available in real life. Even if there is ATIS information, in most cases it is not available online. So where would VATSIM get it from?

METAR and TAF you can obtain easily, but not ATIS.

[Mike Teague]

i think his idea is to use what is available.. in the US the d-atis is available at all the major airports. aircraft like the fslabs a320 already can pull it right through acars when there is no vatsim controller

 

since the coc does allow people to do what they want when the airport is uncontrolled though i guess it would just be used in an advisory fashion

 

Edited June 5, 2022 at 12:45 PM by Mike Teague

[Tobias Dammers]

Agree that this wouldn't really solve any real problems. You can already pull in real-world ATIS yourself, and when there's no VATSIM ATIS, you are free to use that in an advisory fashion (it doesn't absolve you from the requirement to coordinate on Unicom anyway). Forwarding that information through VATSIM would increase server load for marginal gains, AND potentially create confusion, because now you can't tell anymore whether an ATIS you're getting is an actual VATSIM one, or one that was forwarded from IRL. Worse yet, it is possible for ATIS identifiers to line up just the wrong way. Consider this scenario:

• ATC is offline for airport KXYZ. Real-world ATIS identifier is Z.
• Real-world ATIS rolls around to A. Pilot fetches ATIS.
• ATC logs on and posts ATIS, starting at A - but this is a different ATIS than the real-world one.
• Pilot makes initial call, reporting information A.
• "Information Alpha current" - except that it's a different information A - the entire ATIS identifier system is now moot.