Dual Graphics Card

[Alex McGillicuddy 1001707]

I'm looking at a new system for my online flying experience, and for a graphics card I came across the choice of a nVidia Geforce 8800 GT 512 mb, or a dual 8800 GT. My question is would it be worth spending the couple extra hundred bucks for a dual 8800 GT or would the single be enough to run FSX with mid settings plus add ons and stuff. Or should i just stick with fs9.

 

Thanks

Alex

[Brian Sperduto 856560]

My personal opinion is you are better off spending that money on a better single card than multiple cards. I run an 8800GTX and at least in FS9 it runs fine with all the settings maxed out. I think you will serve yourself better investing the money in another part of the computer rather than an SLI configuration

[David Quinlan 1045857]

FSX doesn't really tax most 8800 cards, it is the CPU that gets you. I would suggest getting a single 8800GT and then getting the fastest CPU you can lay your hands on. You will get much better performance from that combination as opposed to a sli configuration with a slow CPU.

[Robert Kurtz 1034837]

FSX doesn't really tax most 8800 cards, it is the CPU that gets you. I would suggest getting a single 8800GT and then getting the fastest CPU you can lay your hands on. You will get much better performance from that combination as opposed to a sli configuration with a slow CPU.

 

That's basically what I did, and it's going swimmingly.

[Alex McGillicuddy 1001707]

Ok, thanks for the replies guys. As for the CPU these are the specs I was looking at and its the new Dell XPS 630.

 

Intel® Core™2 Q6600 Quad-Core (8MB L2 cache,2.40GHz,1066FSB)

Genuine Windows Vistaâ„¢ Home Premium

Dual nVidia® GeForce® 8800 GT 512MB

2GB Corsair Dominator DDR2 SDRAM 800MHz-2 DIMMs

 

Thats with the dual and is about $1800, with the 8800 GTX it's about $1950, I can also get the specs above with the single 8800 GT and that costs around $1550 and I don't want to go over the 2 grand range. But would it be worth the money upgrading to the GTX? Or could I manage well with the single.

 

Thanks

Alex

[Daniel Churchman 1050104]

Alex, feed your machine more RAM. 2Gb sounds like a lot, and you'd be right, but I would recommend adding to that. Everything I've read says this is one of the prime factors in FSX performance.

 

I recently upgraded from a Radeon 1300 with 256Mb DDR to a single nVidia 8800GT with 512Mb DDR3, and while everything looks nicer, I really couldn't turn my graphics up very much. I also went from 1Gb to 2Gb of RAM. Unfortunately, it is only PC3200 RAM, and 2Gb is the limit for my motherboard.

 

A better GPU may help, but the gains will be minimal if your PC can't feed it fast enough, if you get my meaning. That seems to be my woe right now, as I see plenty of people with 8800GT's who have superior performance AND quality over my configuration.

[Garry Morris 920567]

With Vista, you want a minimum of 3gb of RAM.

 

Can you get XP on that box? I'd recommend it.

[Gene Anthony Tarca 1033412]

Hope you get a Core2Duo/Quad which has a 1333MHz of FSB instead of a 1066MHz,, surely, with the 1333MHz your unit can process data much faster..

 

and all others here are right, if you're targeting FSX spend on the CPU next is RAM preferably 3Gb (as 32bit OS limits) DDR2 800 above (ie 1066) brands like Tracer Ballistix, Corsair, Patriot etc

 

an 8800GT is a best for the buck BANG! card.. just a guideline, go for a GFX card with a lot of memory bandwidth 256bit and above, Video Memory only implies when you talk about resolution (24" displays and above/ Multiple Display) also High Clock Frequencies, Overclock if it permits you (Good Cooling)

 

well just my two cents, goodluck on your RIG!

[Alex McGillicuddy 1001707]

Ok guys, I can get 4GB and that just costs an extra 50 bucks. Also why XP? Everything will be vista soon so shouldn't I be making the transistion to vista? So as of now I have all the above specs except 4 GB of ram, I also decided to stick with the single 8800GT and not the GTX. So i' guess i just have to decide vista or XP.

 

Thanks

Alex

[Sven Groot 1044304]

I'd say go with Vista. It runs really well on modern hardware (although nVidia drivers can still be problematic) and there's no noticable performance difference in FSX for me (that's with an ATI card though, I can't make guarantees for nVidia).

 

Vista isn't perfect, but neither is XP, and with SP1 most of the really major issues people were having have been resolved.

 

If you get Vista x64 you'll be able to use the full 4GB memory (the regular x86 version will be able to use about 3.2GB depending on the rest of your hardware, same is true for XP or any 32 bit OS) but with x64 you have to be really careful with picking your hardware for driver compatibility.

[Gene Anthony Tarca 1033412]

saw an evaluation on the web regarding the percentage of crashes contributed by manufacturers to Vista, and based on it, nvidia has the biggest percentage that caused crashes on vista, followed by microsoft, then intel.. etc..

 

does 4gb RAM works on 32bit Vista?

[Sven Groot 1044304]

does 4gb RAM works on 32bit Vista?

It works, but the OS will not be able to use all of it. Same as on XP. This is a technical limitation which I wrote about here.

[Luke Kolin]

saw an evaluation on the web regarding the percentage of crashes contributed by manufacturers to Vista, and based on it, nvidia has the biggest percentage that caused crashes on vista, followed by microsoft, then intel.. etc..

 

Keep in mind that nVidia writes drivers for chipsets as well as video cards, unlike ATI, and we don't know what percentage of those crashes come from which segment.

 

Cheers!

 

Luke

[Alex McGillicuddy 1001707]

From all of your replies I have made ajustments to the system and I came out with this....

 

PROCESSOR Intel® Core™2 Duo Processor E8500 (6MB L2 Cache, 3.16GHz,1333 FSB)

OPERATING SYSTEM Genuine Windows Vistaâ„¢ Home Premium

SYSTEM COLOUR Black Bezel Ch[Mod - Happy Thoughts]is

MEMORY 3GB Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM at 667MHz - 4 DIMMs

HARD DRIVE 320GB - Seagate 7200RPM, SATA 3.0Gb/s, 16MB Cache

SOUND CARD Integrated 7.1 Channel Audio edit

GRAPHICS CARD nVidia® GeForce® 8800 GT 512MB

OPTICAL DRIVE Single Drive: 16X CD/DVD burner (DVD+/-RW) w/double layer write capability

MONITOR 20 inch SP2008WFP Widescreen Flat Panel Monitor

 

hows this look??? In total that is about $1650 which is just the price i was looking for. Also, should I be concerned with nVidia drivers on vista???

 

 

Thanks

Alex

[Sven Groot 1044304]

My laptop (which has a GeForce 8400GS) has been fine with the nVidia drivers but I don't play games on it. They're not as bad anymore, anyway.

 

What's the motherboard? I would strongly recommend getting a motherboard with an Intel chipset.

[Gene Anthony Tarca 1033412]

MEMORY 3GB Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM at 667MHz - 4 DIMMs

 

why not go for an 800 DDR2..well if your 2k budget limits you..its allright, the specs are great in general.. keep us updated.. show us some pictures when its all done..

 

 

 

[Sven Groot 1044304]

Yeah memory speed is an important factor for FSX, also on the video card (video memory bandwidth especially). I wouldn't get lower than DDR2-800 for the system RAM, I'd even get DDR3 if you can afford it.

 

Also, 3GB dual channel? How does that work? 2x1GB and 2x512MB or something?

[Erhan Atesoglu 1050499]

Simple answer i give everyone. Once you get vista... get the Xpansion Pack. It features a new directx 10 engine that is nearly twice as fast. Yes 18-20fps will go to 30+ rendering the game playable!!!! Plus its only 30 dollars and will do more than any hardware upgrade you could add to that configuration.

[Sven Groot 1044304]

Simple answer i give everyone. Once you get vista... get the Xpansion Pack. It features a new directx 10 engine that is nearly twice as fast. Yes 18-20fps will go to 30+ rendering the game playable!!!! Plus its only 30 dollars and will do more than any hardware upgrade you could add to that configuration.

Except in some cases (like mine) where DX10 actually turns 30fps into 10fps, not to mention that aircraft shadows look jagged with DX10. And judging from the comments on Phil Taylor's blog I'm not the only one who's seeing that. Obviously it's working fine for some people, but I'm not one of them.

 

And you don't need Acceleration for DX10, just SP2 will do.

[Alex McGillicuddy 1001707]

Ok, so I'll go with DDR2 at 800 MHZ. Here's my final configuration.

 

 

PROCESSOR Intel® Core™2 Duo Processor E8500 (6MB L2 Cache, 3.16GHz,1333 FSB)

OPERATING SYSTEM Genuine Windows Vistaâ„¢ Home Premium

SYSTEM COLOUR Red Bezel Ch[Mod - Happy Thoughts]is

MEMORY 3GB Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM at 800MHz - 4 DIMMs

HARD DRIVE 320GB - Seagate 7200RPM, SATA 3.0Gb/s, 16MB Cache

SOUND CARD Integrated 7.1 Channel Audio

GRAPHICS CARD nVidia® GeForce® 8800 GT 512MB

OPTICAL DRIVE Single Drive: 16X CD/DVD burner (DVD+/-RW) w/double layer write capability

MONITOR 20 inch SP2008WFP Widescreen Flat Panel Monitor

 

Hows this? I just changed to 800 MHZ from the last configuration.

 

I'll be sure to post some photo's later on.

 

Thanks

Alex

[Richard Ronhovde 1001599]

I have only Perfect experiences with running Dual Grapic Cards.

 

Its perfect, but you should make sure you have the system for it, or its no point.

 

PS: You need a 3rd Party Program to get all your needed Memory RAM to work, so you can go with 8GB of memory or more, its good for flying to have it in plase...

 

This is my new system..:

 

 

 

 

SYSTEM: Quad Core 3.0 GHZ pr CORE, 12 MB Cash

MEMORY: 8 GB (DDR3 running at 1333 MHZ)

MOTHERBOARD: ASUS STRIKER II (1333 MHZ) (On Wather Cooling, avverage temp on max CPU 39 Celsius

GRAPHIC: 2x NVIDIA 8800 GTX (Both is PCI Express, and conected to same Motherboard via SLI Tecnology)

HD: 2X Raptor Disks Running at 12500 RPM (Thay are made for 10000 RPM but slightly adjusted)

MONITOR: 1x 32 INCH Plasma Supporting Resulution 1600, (But i use only 1024 intill system is tested and tryed out)

OS: Windows XP (32 Bit)

FLIGHT CONTROL: CH Yoke, CH Pedals, CH Throttles,

INTERFACE: FS INN 3b connected to an Traffic Librery of 4000+ installed as AI only (Librery comming from IVAO MTL)

FSUIPC: Latest Vertion

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 5, 2008 at 10:05 AM by Guest

[Gene Anthony Tarca 1033412]

SYSTEM: Quad Core 3.0 GHZ pr CORE, 12 MB Cash

MEMORY: 8 GB (DDR3 running at 1333 MHZ)

MOTHERBOARD: ASUS STRIKER II (1333 MHZ) (On Wather Cooling, avverage temp on max CPU 39 Celsius

GRAPHIC: 2x NVIDIA 8800 GTX (Both is PCI Express, and conected to same Motherboard via SLI Tecnology)

HD: 2X Raptor Disks Running at 12500 RPM (Thay are made for 10000 RPM but slightly adjusted)

MONITOR: 1x 32 INCH Plasma Supporting Resulution 1600, (But i use only 1024 intill system is tested and tryed out)

OS: Windows XP (32 Bit)

FLIGHT CONTROL: CH Yoke, CH Pedals, CH Throttles,

INTERFACE: FS INN 3b connected to an Traffic Librery of 4000+ installed as AI only (Librery comming from IVAO MTL)

FSUIPC: Latest Vertion

 

can you share your application? is it freeware?

 

your memory modules are MONSTROUS.. i have only Tracer Ballistix 1066..ehehe..

 

how did you maked you WD raptor to 12.5k RPM?

 

oh, TS, dont forget to secure a reliable and sturdy PSU for your set-up..

[Sven Groot 1044304]

Alex, could you tell me what motherboard you are getting with that system?

 

Richard? An application to make a 32 bit OS support more than 4GB RAM? That doesn't even sound possible. If you could tell what application this is I would be very interested.

 

Furthermore, on a 32 bit OS a process (like Flight Simulator) gets only 2GB of virtual address space (unless you use FSX SP2 and the /3G switch for booting windows, then it gets 3GB; not a good idea on most system btw) so having 8GB RAM won't really help much, even if there is an application that would allow a 32 bit OS to use it (which I doubt). On a 64 bit OS (such as Vista x64) an application that is marked large address aware (such as FSX SP2, but not earlier versions) will get 4GB address space. Apps that are not large address aware still get 2GB.

[Richard Ronhovde 1001599]

Yes you need to understand tha Windows cant normaly use more then 3 GB memory (32 Bit Xp)...

 

But you can buy myltiple programs that will deal with it.

(You wont get same use of that memory over 3GB, but you will get it "accepted" by Windows, and then it should look like this:

 

Ye i know it only say 7GB, but its amyway way over 3GB.. and the Memoryu who is installed is 8GB, and as far as i understand, it will use all 8, evan tho it now only recognises 7GB...

 

 

 

Also, as far as i know, Windows noamrly ONLY allow 4096 in Virtual memory, this i recommend you set to 20000, and to do that you also can tweak it with 3rd party softwere, anyway it should look like this when your done:

 

 

 

 

 

If you have a Raptor Disk running at 10 000 RPM, you can increase the Voltage on the Disk with 0.25V pr time you try, also set "step up 5%" in your Disk Software, (dont go to fast forward), use a Disk Monitoring Program (serverops) and you will see the "simulated" RMP increase some.

Anyway using a 10000 RPM disk is anyway to surgest, I dont think you can tweek other disks then Raptor's (as far as i know anyway).. Note that the slower 7200 RPM Disks cant realy coop with Flight Sim verey well if it gets alot of Add On's and alot of Data IMHO.. so if you buy a new Disk go with a Raptor.

 

 

 

[Sven Groot 1044304]

Yes you need to understand tha Windows cant normaly use more then 3 GB memory (32 Bit Xp)...

 

But you can buy myltiple programs that will deal with it.

Name an example of such an application. These applications are either modifying Windows in a way to allow it to use Physical Address Extension(PAE) to address the additional RAM (and all the methods I can think of to do that would violate the EULA of Windows), or they are doing something that is technically impossible.

 

And to say that Windows only allows you to use 3GB RAM is a simplification. Windows, like any 32 bit OS, can address 4GB of RAM. However, part of this address space will be used by the physical memory mapping of hardware devices like your video card (and many others). Because of this, you lose part of the address space, allowing Windows to use an amount slightly lower than 4GB. How much lower depends on your hardware, but between 3 and 3.5GB is normal. The reason you are still seeing only 7GB with this application of yours is because this memory gap before the 4GB boundary still exists, and either your motherboard is not capable of remapping that memory in 32 bit mode, or the application is not capable of dealing with that.

 

Furthermore, a 20GB swap file is quite frankly insane. I cannot think of any scenario where this would be useful. Windows 32 bit allows a virtual address space of 2GB per process, there is nothing that can be done to change that (except the /3G switch but that doesn't work for all applications and is not recommended). The amount of load you would need to put on the machine to fill that is insane.