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To the newbie - First Time Jitters


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  • 3 weeks later...

Just finished my first flight out of CYYZ to CYUL (ACA530).  I flew this route so many times offline and finally made the jump to vatsim today.

I made a mistake at CYYZ departure and I missed the ILS intercept at CYUL the 1st time (both my fault! the jitters got the better of me), but both ATCs were patient and very accommodating  😀.

Big shoutout to the controllers at CYYZ and CYUL.  That was a huge confidence booster for me!

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First time today, flew VVTS-VVCI (BAV1540), the tower at VVTS was very nice about it being my first time, and offered to go down everything with me from taxi to departure!  If you are the Tower ATC (I forget username), thank you very much and I'll be sure to stop by tomorrow at 6 pm ET

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  • 3 weeks later...

First flight tonight and the comments posted on the first page from 2005 were as real this afternoon as they were then. KPWM to KBOS that worked smooth as silk.  The flight plan on the GPS was slightly different from the VATSIM plan so lesson learned there and I got low and slow on final as I got distracted putting in the ground frequency.  Both were good lessons. 200 hour PPL with Instrument and Commercial written done and what a great workout!  Thank you all!

 

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I so badly want to engage but I'm just not ready. Well over 200 hours in the sim and still not confident enough I'll be able to complete the simplest of flight plans without causing major headaches and traffic issues for the controller.

I've spent several sessions just observing and listening as well as watching many YouTube videos. I'm pretty proficient in the TBM 930 with ILS using the built in ATC in the Sim but the stuff I hear while observing and especially some of the YouTube videos have me convinced that using the in-sim ATC is nothing like VATSIM and probably teaching us bad habits. 

Congratulations to all of you who've made the leap successfully. 

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4 hours ago, Dan Anziano said:

I so badly want to engage but I'm just not ready. Well over 200 hours in the sim and still not confident enough I'll be able to complete the simplest of flight plans without causing major headaches and traffic issues for the controller.

I've spent several sessions just observing and listening as well as watching many YouTube videos. I'm pretty proficient in the TBM 930 with ILS using the built in ATC in the Sim but the stuff I hear while observing and especially some of the YouTube videos have me convinced that using the in-sim ATC is nothing like VATSIM and probably teaching us bad habits. 

Congratulations to all of you who've made the leap successfully. 

Yep, the in-sim ATC is no doubt teaching you some bad phraseology.  But, guess what?  You're not the only one it's happened to.  VATSIM controllers have seen and heard it before.  Embrace the fact that you're not going to sound perfect the first time, fifth time, maybe even the tenth time you get on, and just jump in.  If you end up sounding silly, laugh it off, and get back on the next day and try to do better.  Accept that improvement will be gradual.  Accept that experienced pilots may get a giggle out of it the first few times.  Those giggles are borne less from "man this guy sucks" and more "I remember when I sounded exactly like that."  You WILL NOT get better at it by any other means than jumping in and doing.  Do yourself a favor and look on VAT-Spy or vattastic or simaware and find an area with a controller and not too much traffic around -- there's less pressure on you to get it exactly right, then.  But stop putting it off.  You're more ready than you think you are if you just let go of the phantom goal of sounding perfect the first few times up.  (Some "tough love" advice, hopefully taken in the right spirit.  Hope to see you on soon!)

Edited by Robert Shearman Jr
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Cheers,

-R.

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17 hours ago, Dan Anziano said:

I so badly want to engage but I'm just not ready. Well over 200 hours in the sim and still not confident enough I'll be able to complete the simplest of flight plans without causing major headaches and traffic issues for the controller.

I've spent several sessions just observing and listening as well as watching many YouTube videos. I'm pretty proficient in the TBM 930 with ILS using the built in ATC in the Sim but the stuff I hear while observing and especially some of the YouTube videos have me convinced that using the in-sim ATC is nothing like VATSIM and probably teaching us bad habits. 

Congratulations to all of you who've made the leap successfully. 

I hate to say this but man up. After 200 hours you should be more than ok. Just load up at a small quiet airfield not Heathrow or KJFK and just do some vfr circuits. 

 

Wycliffe Barrett: C3 Controller

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"if god meant for us to fly, he would have given us tickets" Mel Brooks

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I took the plunge last night.  After years of flying sims (as well as obtaining a PPL, years ago) I wanted to try VATSIM.  I loaded-up in an A320 at KBOS for a flight to KIAD. I watched some tutorial videos, built my flight in Simbrief, studied the charts in Navigraph, and felt reasonably prepared... I wasn't.

I laughed as I reached for the transmit button to obtain my clearance, noticing that I was sweating and my hand quivered a little.  It's amazing how a microphone and virtual plane pixels can evoke such a reaction.

I waited for a break in the radio chatter, requested my clearance and the controller rattled off the route and frequencies in a 5-second burst; I was like... 'uh, can you say that again?'  Even knowing my route and the expected freqs, using the CRAFT model, it still felt overwhelming.  Fortunately the KBOS ground controller was patient with my botched attempt to copy my clearance,  and I managed to find my way to the runway and takeoff.  I took-heart as I listened to other new pilots that were struggling to fly a SID and receiving a lot of guidance from CTR... at least I had that part managed (for now).  Overall, this was a great experience, but definitely not flying and chilling with a beer while watching TV.  I enjoyed the challenge and the patience of the controllers, and I look forward to learning and getting more involved with the VATSIM community. 

Thanks to the Boston team that was online last night.

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27 minutes ago, Bruce Krapovicky said:

I took the plunge last night.  After years of flying sims (as well as obtaining a PPL, years ago) I wanted to try VATSIM.  I loaded-up in an A320 at KBOS for a flight to KIAD. I watched some tutorial videos, built my flight in Simbrief, studied the charts in Navigraph, and felt reasonably prepared... I wasn't.

I laughed as I reached for the transmit button to obtain my clearance, noticing that I was sweating and my hand quivered a little.  It's amazing how a microphone and virtual plane pixels can evoke such a reaction.

I waited for a break in the radio chatter, requested my clearance and the controller rattled off the route and frequencies in a 5-second burst; I was like... 'uh, can you say that again?'  Even knowing my route and the expected freqs, using the CRAFT model, it still felt overwhelming.  Fortunately the KBOS ground controller was patient with my botched attempt to copy my clearance,  and I managed to find my way to the runway and takeoff.  I took-heart as I listened to other new pilots that were struggling to fly a SID and receiving a lot of guidance from CTR... at least I had that part managed (for now).  Overall, this was a great experience, but definitely not flying and chilling with a beer while watching TV.  I enjoyed the challenge and the patience of the controllers, and I look forward to learning and getting more involved with the VATSIM community. 

Thanks to the Boston team that was online last night.

I will say there is a ground controller at Boston that prides himself on speaking as fast as he can... not sure why as it is inefficient and counterintuitive. 

Glad you had a good experience otherwise!

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2 hours ago, Grant Williams said:

... there is a ground controller at Boston that prides himself on speaking as fast as he can... not sure why as it is inefficient and counterintuitive.

I've wondered about that. Not just here ... not just ATC ... not just VATSIM.
Doing radio in army infantry, or (licensed ham since 1968, age 14) emergency comms or contesting ...
Isn't the point getting information across with //zaroo// confusion? no ambiguity? no errors? Isn't "speed" just the payoff of being efficitent?

I cut my hippie hair in 1970. I lost all support for mindless benevolence and definitely slid over onto the red-neck side of the spectrum. But a big part of that was explicit condemnation of ":I'm a great man and you must keep up with me unless you want to be seen as inferior" attitude.

Seems to me pretty clear that a person who is sane and reasonable and effective will module speed and tone to meet what is required by the situation. Imagine rushing and blowing someone off in an emergency! There really is no limit to egoism. Is why we have professional standards.

clear skies / fair winds!
--ben

p.s. I wrote tech_docs for such as landing systems. If the reader didn't get the meaning of what I wrote, that's my failure ... always.


 

Edited by bernard tremblay

intersections.gif

If you look to see how the system works

Likely you will find that it doesn't.

1018262.jpg

@bentrem - FSX SP2 | AMD Athlon II 630 2.8GHz X4 | GA-MA785 | Radeon 5770 | 6GB DDR3 | XP Pro | Saitek X52

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On 9/5/2020 at 2:27 PM, Ernesto Martinez said:

My recommendation is to take the airport diagram and draw the path that ATC gives you before moving. 

I will admit that I find U.S. charts easier to follow that some of the European ones but they all follow the same guidelines more or less. 

This is the taxi diagram for Orlando. If you are parked on Airside 4 and the controller tells you, "Runway 36R taxi via H4, G, E, B, B10. Then what I suggest is to convert that diagram into this before moving. If you don't understand something, clarify. If you get lost along the way, stop and look at the signs and locate yourself on the map. But overall, remember that this is a learning environment and we're all here to have fun. If you make a mistake, take it as a learning opportunity and continue. 

 Therefore, navigation at the airport on the ground, can be much more difficult than flying.

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On 11/22/2005 at 7:49 AM, Robin Frank 938753 said:

Okay, I'll contribute to the thread. I got the software working and have been observing while parked out of the way for a while. I'l be doing some GA VFR flying online later this week. I'll be getting an extension for my headset so I can plug the microphone into the back of the computer, but the earphones into the front(for easy removal).

 

Of course, I won't be flying with my VA's call sign so if I do anything dumb, it is [Mod - Happy Thoughts]ociated with me only.

What happens if you do show up with your VA's call sign? They stop giving you a cookie? 😆

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On 9/1/2020 at 8:22 AM, Mathew Thieneman said:

I did my 2nd airline flight last night on VATSIM, flying into Halifax International for Moncton Monday.

I'm naturally a bundle or nerves, so jumping onto VATSIM has been slow going for me, but last night was a great experience. The guys staffing Montreal Center, and all the way to touchdown in Halifax were great.

A few tips for anyone doing their first few trips on VATSIM:

* Grab a pin and paper to write information down. It's a life saver for readbacks.

* Clearance is probably the most intimidating aspect for beginners, in my experience. Writing it all down, and having my SIDs pulled up for the airport helped a ton. I also developed some shorthand to get it down quicker and don't be afraid to ask for a repeat.

* Radio calls generally flow <who you're contacting> <who you are> <your location (altitude if in the air first)> and your call.

* Be comfortable with what you're flying. I flew the 727, which can be complicated, but I was way better with it than the 737-800.

* Prepare your next Com or Nav switch before hand when you can. So if you enter Montreal Centers Airspace, you can prepare the next switch for Boston Center before you get there. If you're on a VOR and you're next Nav will be the ILS, go ahead and set it as your switch.

* Use Com2 to monitor Unicom, Approach ATIS, or the next handoff. This is a sneaky good trick I learned. You don't want to switch off Center to monitor ATIS, and when approaching a handoff, it can be useful to listen to the upcoming Center as well. If it gets too much you can turn of Com2s audio, or switch it over to an empty frequency.

 

 Grabbing a pen and paper is a "life saver"?  What if I don't write fast enough nor can I even understand what the guy's saying. After all, not everybody has the top-of-the-line controllers that Indianapolis  has and the guy at Los Angeles I spoke of earlier. Sorry, dude. I don't go through the drama. My life doesn't depend on it. I just call back the departure I ALREADY have in front of me, on the read back. If it ain't right, then it ain't right. Then I don't get clearance? OH kay.. 😪

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16 minutes ago, Jim Rish said:

Sorry, dude. I don't go through the drama. My life doesn't depend on it. I just call back the departure I ALREADY have in front of me, on the read back. If it ain't right, then it ain't right. Then I don't get clearance? OH kay..

"Say again slower" is your friend. Everything else is just....wrong.

And: no professional pilot writes down the clearance in full words, but develops and uses his or her own method of scribbling that contains all the information. If you can't do this, please practice before visiting busy airports and events.

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Funny thread - but so true.

Not a pilot but one of my best friends is, I've flown right seat with him a lot, and the thing I've LOVED about it all is the geeky technical stuff.  The lingo, the on-the-spot math, etc.  I've been using the FS2020 ATC, and purposely vocally doing the readback, etc. before clicking the button to readback, trying to get the hang of the order of things, etc.  At some point I will likely go for my PPL in real life... been on hold because I already have enough stupid expensive hobbies (racing sims in the winter, real racing in the summer).

Did my first "half" flight last night using VATSIM (half because departure was under VATSIM ATC, arrival was uncontrolled).  Flew from Ann Arbor, MI to Lake in the Hills, IL - and Cleveland Center controlled the departure space.  Was able to fire up the plane, get my IFR, taxi, departure clearance, etc. all without getting yelled at 🙂 Made it all the way to the handoff back to 122.800 (nobody on in Chicago region) but damn that was COOL!  I deliberately chose a small airport in a region that had ATC coverage but clearly not a lot of traffic so I wouldn't cause problems if I was slow or screwed up.

One thing I definitely know - pen/paper is KEY, as is preparation (knowing your route, etc.)

The challenge.... I fly exclusively in VR. (IMO it just adds to the immersion and the experience.). But that presents a challenge when it comes to things like writing... AND operating the multiple encoder knobs to change frequencies, etc.  Head moves, the mouse moves, suddenly you lose your click spot, etc.  At least with writing I can see out along my nose to see what I'm writing.  But then viewing charts, etc.... 

I'm going to likely hold off on doing a full on VATSIM experience again until I can build a button box to handle some of the radio work.  (Literally can take me 2-3 minutes to enter in a new radio frequency because the mouse interaction with the FS2020 knobs is almost impossible.)

I thought I could "waste" a ton of time in my racing simulator. FS2020 in VR puts that to shame though...

Edited by James Ptak
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Just now, Andreas Fuchs said:

"Say again slower" is your friend. Everything else is just....wrong.

And: no professional pilot writes down the clearance in full words, but develops and uses his or her own method of scribbling that contains all the information. If you can't do this, please practice before visiting busy airports and events.

I know what say again means. I don't need a primer from you or anybody else on the subject. Furthermore, I do well enough on my own at any of your "events", whatever that means, regardless of how "busy" they are.  👩‍🔬

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Just now, James Ptak said:

in until I can build a button box to handle some of the radio work.  (Literally can take me 2-3 minutes to enter in a new radio frequency because the mouse interaction with the FS2020 knobs is almost impossible.)

I thought I could "waste" a ton of time in my racing simulator. FS2020 in VR puts that to shame though...

Sorry to hear that. I was gonna get a top-of-the-line video card, like you obviously have to run this thing, but thanks for talkin' me out of it. At least for FS2020 anyways. 🧑‍🏫

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21 minutes ago, Jim Rish said:

I know what say again means. I don't need a primer from you or anybody else on the subject.

You could be a comedian. Have you tried that? 😄

But I think you need to work on your reading-skills: say again slower. Read the entire sentence, not just the first two words. Have fun, enjoy your bubble.

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12 minutes ago, Jim Rish said:

Sorry to hear that. I was gonna get a top-of-the-line video card, like you obviously have to run this thing, but thanks for talkin' me out of it. At least for FS2020 anyways. 🧑‍🏫

Well if you're gonna pony up for a top-of-the-line card... you're already gonna be in for 4 figures.  Spend a few extra and buy a button box with dual rotary encoders.  🙂

 

Most of the buttons, the mouse is fine.  But the rotary knobs that are dual + push button... it can be maddening as the mouse hovers and you try to find the difference between the outer ring twist (+ and -), an inner ring twist (+ and -), and a push click.  Even more maddening is the 4-way for the map zoom on the Garmin 1000.... it twists, clicks in 4 directions plus clicks "in".  It's almost impossible to find the "twist" action with the mouse.  Haven't figured out the trick to it yet.

I submitted a feature request to the FS2020 team for webcam support.  I'm pretty sure this was doable with the FlyInside add-on for FSX.... queue up a Webcam preview, then aim the webcam at your desk where you place a pen, paper, iPad for charts, etc.

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I'll say that something else that using VATSIM has me considering?

A better tail number lol.

I basically came up with it as my racing # plus my initials.  But it doesn't roll off the tongue.  Gonna have to think a bit just so I'm not stuttering all over the place to get my own dang tail number out of my mouth.

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40 minutes ago, James Ptak said:

Well if you're gonna pony up for a top-of-the-line card... you're already gonna be in for 4 figures.  Spend a few extra and buy a button box with dual rotary encoders.  🙂

 

 

 This is what a friend of mine, call sign Hawg,  sent me. I don't know how to operate everything on it, but there are two dials, rotary 3 aND 4 axis,  I guess could be set for for the radio.  Elite%20Dangerous%20Joystick%20Bindings.

Edited by Jim Rish
mention Hawg's controller.

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  • 4 weeks later...
On 1/2/2021 at 5:30 PM, Bruce Krapovicky said:

I took the plunge last night.  After years of flying sims (as well as obtaining a PPL, years ago) I wanted to try VATSIM.  I loaded-up in an A320 at KBOS for a flight to KIAD. I watched some tutorial videos, built my flight in Simbrief, studied the charts in Navigraph, and felt reasonably prepared... I wasn't.

I laughed as I reached for the transmit button to obtain my clearance, noticing that I was sweating and my hand quivered a little.  It's amazing how a microphone and virtual plane pixels can evoke such a reaction.

I waited for a break in the radio chatter, requested my clearance and the controller rattled off the route and frequencies in a 5-second burst; I was like... 'uh, can you say that again?'  Even knowing my route and the expected freqs, using the CRAFT model, it still felt overwhelming.  Fortunately the KBOS ground controller was patient with my botched attempt to copy my clearance,  and I managed to find my way to the runway and takeoff.  I took-heart as I listened to other new pilots that were struggling to fly a SID and receiving a lot of guidance from CTR... at least I had that part managed (for now).  Overall, this was a great experience, but definitely not flying and chilling with a beer while watching TV.  I enjoyed the challenge and the patience of the controllers, and I look forward to learning and getting more involved with the VATSIM community. 

Thanks to the Boston team that was online last night.

Just this weekend 24/1/2021) I did my first flight with VATSIM with GND AND TWR. I was at Bournemouth Sunday afternoon and experienced the same petrified reaction. So much so that I veered left when leaving the runway while trying to reach cruise height when I was supposed to be doing rt circuits! aaaghhh... The Tower told me off (which crushed my confidence even more). It might have been better if he simply gave me a heading to put me right. I then managed the rest of my singular circuit ok, though I would love to play it back to learn from mistakes (Anyone know if this is possible?). I don't think I will be doing VATSIM again for a while. I nearly had a heart attack. I think it is because some seem to take this so very seriously that they lose sight of the "fun" aspect and that they were once learners themselves.

Some weeks ago, I did find the Ground control at Jersey was very sympathetic and helpful. I had no twr then but ground was giving me tips and was very calming. Admittedly he didn't have much traffic.

Enjoy what you can guys. At least it is without any fixed charge.

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4 hours ago, Kevin Giles said:

The Tower told me off (which crushed my confidence even more). It might have been better if he simply gave me a heading to put me right.

 

  Why, indeed, didn't tower do that, then?  ATC must not be too busy where you are in order to make some cheap jabs in order to pass the time. 😙.  I'm not sure I get what happened out of veering off, or whatever altitude you're talkin' about.  I assume that you just simply failed to fly runway heading? I don't know. But, then again, who cares? You can simply get back on track later on.  But anyways, a heart attack? 🙆‍♀️

Edited by Jim Rish
grammar, points.

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