UK (?) Plugin creating issues

[Daniel Klepp]

Hello, when controlling in Norway i experience quite often that as soon as i release an aircraft with DEP within the UK, or sometimes when i [Mod - Happy Thoughts]ign squawk before tracking it, someone somewhere [Mod - Happy Thoughts]igns a new squawk and a temp altitude of typically 4000/5000ft.

 

I guess it is some plugin interfering? Would be nice if someone caught that bug

 

Attaching a picture of an aircraft i just released on the border between Norway and Sweden. Immediately changed temp alt and squawk when released.

[Hakan Schulz 937154]

I experienced exactly the same behaviour with two aircrafts just now when I was on ESOS

(1) BAW169 from EGLL -> ZSPD

(2) XMS24 from EGKK -> EFRO

[Jonas Kuster]

Unfortunately, this is already an issue for a very very long time. It's caused generally by controllers from Britain, so I guess VCA is the causer. There are some automatic changes of values done by this plugin, but unfortunately also outside the covering area. This means, even a tower station online in GB which previously had contact with an aircraft will initiate change of cleared flight level and squawk even if I have the concerning aircraft [Mod - Happy Thoughts]igned. The network protocol doesn't prevent this, so a plugin can change values also when the aircraft is [Mod - Happy Thoughts]igned by another controller. This is exactly what happens.

I already tried to explain the issue in the UK forum (because VCA is/was developped by Craig Phillips from VATSIM UK) and found other controllers experiencing the same issue (https://community.vatsim-uk.co.uk/topic/27772-virtual-controller-[Mod - Happy Thoughts]istant-vca-new-euroscope-plugin/?do=findComment&comment=296374). Unfortunately, Craig is neither very active nor showing understanding and offering support to fix the issue.

Perhaps, we have to bring the issue to the next level and aiming for a change of the server software to prevent such (by the network rules) forbidden commands. Generally you could say, every member using this plugin and causing this kind of commands is violating the network rules. But I think it's clear that a punishment of individual members isn't really a solution.

[Daniel Klepp]

Thank you for the information, process has been started in Vatsim Scandinavia to report this via our Director to get it "up in the system". We'll see how that plays out.

[Simon Irvine]

Guys

 

Apologies for this. We are currently working with Craig regarding this issue. It will be sorted, one way or another, by the beginning of January.

 

Thanks

 

 

Simon

[Craig Phillips 947617]

Unfortunately, this is already an issue for a very very long time. It's caused generally by controllers from Britain, so I guess VCA is the causer. There are some automatic changes of values done by this plugin, but unfortunately also outside the covering area. This means, even a tower station online in GB which previously had contact with an aircraft will initiate change of cleared flight level and squawk even if I have the concerning aircraft [Mod - Happy Thoughts]igned. The network protocol doesn't prevent this, so a plugin can change values also when the aircraft is [Mod - Happy Thoughts]igned by another controller. This is exactly what happens.

I already tried to explain the issue in the UK forum (because VCA is/was developped by Craig Phillips from VATSIM UK) and found other controllers experiencing the same issue (https://community.vatsim-uk.co.uk/topic/27772-virtual-controller-[Mod - Happy Thoughts]istant-vca-new-euroscope-plugin/?do=findComment&comment=296374). Unfortunately, Craig is neither very active nor showing understanding and offering support to fix the issue.

Perhaps, we have to bring the issue to the next level and aiming for a change of the server software to prevent such (by the network rules) forbidden commands. Generally you could say, every member using this plugin and causing this kind of commands is violating the network rules. But I think it's clear that a punishment of individual members isn't really a solution.

 

I am aware of this issue, and I have Euroscope logs that have been sent with people who are experiencing this issue. Despite having these logs of the issue, I have never seen the issue myself, which makes it difficult to resolve a problem I cannot see. I have attempted to make a fix and released it to several beta testers, however it does not seem to have resolved the problem. Unfortunately, due to work and university commitments I have not been able to commit much time to VCA, but I am aware that VCA is close to being unsupported by VAT-UK (which I do not which to happen).

 

I will try my hardest to commit the majority of my free time this week before Christmas solely on VCA.

 

Merry Christmas!

 

Craig

[Andreas Fuchs]

Hi Craig,

 

great to see you are willing to invest time into solving these problems. Keeping fingers crossed that you will find the issue in your code quickly.

[Jonas Kuster]

I will try my hardest to commit the majority of my free time this week before Christmas solely on VCA.

Very happy to hear that. I know free time is a rare thing for most people contributing to the VATSIM network, for me also. Sorry about my harsh words, but my hope for improvement was nearly gone after I attempted several times to get in contact with you and even offered my help in testing the new version, but received no answer ...

[Anthony Lawrence]

All,

 

You'll see Craig has worked to put out a fix for this issue: https://community.vatsim-uk.co.uk/topic/27772-virtual-controller-[Mod - Happy Thoughts]istant-vca-new-euroscope-plugin/?page=8#comment-307773

 

As controllers download the new tool, you'll notice this happens less and less. We've put measures in place to ensure this type of issue doesn't taken in excess of 12 months to resolve in the future.

 

Apologies to anyone it's impacted.

 

Regards,

Anthony

[Andreas Fuchs]

Thank you very much for following up on this!

[Mark Nelson 1266047]

As controllers download the new tool, you'll notice this happens less and less. We've put measures in place to ensure this type of issue doesn't taken in excess of 12 months to resolve in the future.

It has been 17 months now and the problem still occurs on a regular basis, mainly for traffic from and to the UK. Although today I had it happen to all traffic arriving from LEPA as well. They were all cleared to 5000 feet despite p[Mod - Happy Thoughts]ing a radar sector before reaching LSAS airspace.

 

I kindly ask you to make controllers aware of what to do to have this stop. We've lived with it and not said anything (at least in this thread) for a long time now. In my opinion, the time should've been sufficient to sort this out.

[Michael Pike]

I recommend controllers disable the initial altitude setting function. It's not that much of a benefit anyway.

[Mark Nelson 1266047]

I recommend controllers disable the initial altitude setting function. It's not that much of a benefit anyway.

I'd highly appreciate that.

[Pierre Ferran]

I agree, the problem still persists despite the new version. Plugins should simply not modify any tag data if the aircraft is not [Mod - Happy Thoughts]umed, as the network and EuroScope handle it badly.

[Pavel Brodsky]

I think BoG should intervene here as this is clearly a flaw in vatsim protocol. Maybe the protocol could be hotfixed or clients using this plugin be automatically kicked? This is potentially huge problem. Anybody from BoG here?

 

Pavel

[Trevor Hannant]

I think BoG should intervene here as this is clearly a flaw in vatsim protocol. Maybe the protocol could be hotfixed or clients using this plugin be automatically kicked? This is potentially huge problem. Anybody from BoG here?

 

Pavel

 

You want to kick off dozens of active controllers in one of the busiest divisions? Bit much isn't it?

[Bradley Grafelman]

You want to kick off dozens of active controllers in one of the busiest divisions? Bit much isn't it?

Perhaps he has faith that those dozens of controllers will be just as capable of performing their duties without using one (apparently malfunctioning) plugin.

[Matthew Burton 1270824]

Perhaps he has faith that those dozens of controllers will be just as capable of performing their duties without using one (apparently malfunctioning) plugin.

Would you like to show your alternative to give us a squawk code to and from any airport in the world without having to mess about with tables of codes, pick one, enter it, to find it is already in use and have to pick again, all while managing a busy frequency? And I'm sure you wouldn't be to happy if I vectored you through the localiser because I'm to busy finding a code to some remote location.

[Morten Jelle]

Don't fight - it is just a plugin.

The issue has been identified and will (hopefully soon) be corrected. But it seems currently that it is not only the plugin that causes trouble but Euroscope itself.

 

I know how annoying this is, but there are people looking at the issue - they just need to find a suitable fix for it.

[Andreas Fuchs]

Would you like to show your alternative to give us a squawk code to and from any airport in the world without having to mess about with tables of codes, pick one, enter it, to find it is already in use and have to pick again, all while managing a busy frequency?

Just press F9 one more time in Euroscope and you'll get another transponder code that will probably work...

 

I agree that the problems that this plugin is creating need to be resolved ASAP, but they are not the end of the world. The effects are just VERY annoying for neighbouring controllers!

[Philipp Edlich]

The effects are just VERY annoying for neighbouring controllers!

They are annoying for every controller after UK sectors. I have a lot of aircrafts from EG** p[Mod - Happy Thoughts]ing through LJLA_CTR/ADR_CTR and often need to deal with their tags longer than necessary. And potentially miss instructing a final turn myself.

[Simon Irvine]

Folks

 

Although this plug in is no longer officially [Mod - Happy Thoughts]ociated with the Division, I have spoken to the developer tonight who has been testing a fix.

 

I am hoping that this issue will be resolved very soon.

 

Thanks

 

Simon

[Andreas Fuchs]

Fingers crossed!

 

I know that Craig has the best of intentions and I really hope that this fix will resolve the problem, finally.

[Pavel Brodsky]

You want to kick off dozens of active controllers in one of the busiest divisions? Bit much isn't it?

 

Now imagine that those dozens of active controllers are controlling their busiest airports and some unknown guy connects at the smallest airport tower on the other side of the globe and starts using his software that would interfere with 80% the busiest division's traffic. Don't you think somebody would .wallop him?

 

Thanks to Craig for investigating, but I am afraid that it will be quite long term project to instruct everybody to update their plugins. Lot of people don't visit forums daily or will not notice at all. But maybe the plugin has automatic update, who knows...

 

Pavel

[Thimo Koolen]

As far as I'm aware, the plugin pops a message in Euroscope if you log in with an outdated plugin. Also squawk codes won't work in older versions, so they'll notice soon enough.