Art Nicewander 1129189 Posted October 16, 2009 at 07:31 PM Posted October 16, 2009 at 07:31 PM I would also like to praise the Controllers as well as the other pilots. I am a real student with only 6 hours and did that 4 years ago. I decided I am going to get my real ticket before I die. So I downloaded squawkbox and have been flying mostly from KOPN just south of ATL to get my VFR skills back up to speed. I did do a small flight from KAZO to KORD and also had a slight screw up and the controller there was very professional. I wish I could of gotten his name and sing his praise a bit. Anyway, I am finding this a great learning tool especially if you issues with choking up talking to ATC while in the real airplane. As a low hour student that has been one of my hardest things to get p[Mod - Happy Thoughts]ed is talking to ATL Approach. I lock up a lot, so its a mental issue I guess. Another note, I am joining the ATC here in ATL. Why? because it will help me greatly p[Mod - Happy Thoughts] the written when it comes to airspace and procedures for an IFR rating down the road. Thanks to all in the Vatsim community for the great work here. Art Nicewander KOPN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Swanson 1105524 Posted October 18, 2009 at 03:22 AM Posted October 18, 2009 at 03:22 AM I'm still a lil scared to i havnt even talk cus i dont rly kno wat 2 say i mean i kno wat to say but do alot of the ATC get mad if u let them kno ur new and all that or will they take there time... What are good airports to do this at with a controller? :? :? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sebastien Bartosz Posted October 18, 2009 at 07:20 AM Posted October 18, 2009 at 07:20 AM Andy, try talking like a human please. This is a forum, not MSN or your cellphone. New York ARTCC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Townend 893724 Posted October 19, 2009 at 12:12 PM Posted October 19, 2009 at 12:12 PM Andy, try talking like a human please. This is a forum, not MSN or your cellphone. Agree completely (you may be familiar with "text speak" but some people here are not familiar with English, let alone "text speak"), but, to answer your question Andy, no, the controllers wont get mad, they were all new at one time or another and so will try to help as best they can. Tell them you are new, listen in to the frequency for a bit and ask questions using private chat (or Teamspeak) not the frequency. Take a look through the pages in this thread, you'll see plenty of people are making mistakes and learning from the experience, they are better pilots/controllers for it. Best airfield to do this at? A medium sized airfield that is not too busy, avoid places like Heathrow (EGLL) and John F Kennedy (KJFK) as they are major hubs and they are more difficult to learn from as people have less free time to help. A local field is also helpful as it's quicker to learn the area due to familiarity. Welcome. Mark Townend --------------------------- OC 22 Group, vRAF & VFFG Founder BAv Captain (Ret'd), UK SERTS S3 (Ret'd) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Nicewander 1129189 Posted October 21, 2009 at 03:54 PM Posted October 21, 2009 at 03:54 PM Agree with Mark. Fly at a satellite airport outside the Cl[Mod - Happy Thoughts] B. I finally had enough courage to enter the Cl[Mod - Happy Thoughts] B VFR which requires minimal interaction with ATC on Vatsim. But it at least forced me to request clearance in and out of the Cl[Mod - Happy Thoughts] B. I will be taking a real C172 Skylane up and actually do it for real here shortly. I am not currently working on figuring out how to do IFR flight planes using the current departure sids and starts. I am finding it an issue with FS2004 and will require me to modify the .pln file. Anyway, a great tool since I used it last. I was using this when squawkbox first started and boy it has changed for the good. Have fun flying Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roddie Hasan 1113379 Posted October 21, 2009 at 04:13 PM Posted October 21, 2009 at 04:13 PM I am not currently working on figuring out how to do IFR flight planes using the current departure sids and starts. I am finding it an issue with FS2004 and will require me to modify the .pln file. Art, I found that route tools such as simroutes.com and such do a pretty good job at mimicking many SIDs/STARs in the exported .PLN files so that you can use them with the FS2004 GPS, at least for lateral navigation. A quick comparison to the actual charts can usually verify this, then it's just up to you to control your altitude and speed. Roddie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Williams 877539 Posted October 22, 2009 at 07:01 PM Posted October 22, 2009 at 07:01 PM I found that route tools such as simroutes.com and such do a pretty good job at mimicking many SIDs/STARs in the exported .PLN files so that you can use them with the FS2004 GPS, at least for lateral navigation. A quick comparison to the actual charts can usually verify this, then it's just up to you to control your altitude and speed. Or, better yet, leave the GPS off and just use SIDs and STARs that can be flown with nothing other than a VOR/DME. Almost all airports have them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karl Kornel 964857 Posted October 25, 2009 at 05:50 AM Posted October 25, 2009 at 05:50 AM Or, better yet, leave the GPS off and just use SIDs and STARs that can be flown with nothing other than a VOR/DME. Almost all airports have them. +1 (probably the first time I've posted a "+1", but it's worth it! A. Karl Kornel - vZID C1, FE, and Mentor Smoke Bomb! POOF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Schultz 1130446 Posted October 28, 2009 at 10:55 PM Posted October 28, 2009 at 10:55 PM In response to the initial thread topic, I had serious jitters when first taking off from my home airport KSEA a little over a week and a half ago. Fortunately traffic wasn't very heavy so I wasn't under too much pressure. Though I the nervousness was still there and resulted in the issue of my clearances and instructions going straight from my ears to my mouth so I'd have forgotten them immediately after reading them back...forcing me to stupidly ask the controller to repeat what he'd said, right after I'd just read it back to him. Anyway, things went more or less smoothly; I had been studying SID/STAR charts for a while and done a good amount of offline IFR flying so I pretty much knew what to do. I was cleared for takeoff, I revved up the engines, and soared into the skies of VATSIM for the first time. It was a wonderful moment, punctuated by the controller adding "Congratulations on your first flight!" to his approval for me to tune Approach. I beamed, and responded, "Thanks much! Over to app--" The simulator CTD'd. And it continues to do so all too frequently; I still haven't figured out why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Kraft Posted November 6, 2009 at 07:13 AM Posted November 6, 2009 at 07:13 AM I just did my first IFR flight on vatsim. I've been in contact with ATC in the real world before but it was VFR and (minus the Touch and Gos at KRDG) I knew that they weren't telling me what to do for the most part, just where to go to not hit anyone (and the skies were empty that day). Now I've worked in emergency services for as long as I've been able to get a job (6 years) so I've never had a problem talking over the radio to dispatchers, but when I contacted clearance delivery for clearance from LAX to SFO, I wrote as much as I could until about half way through the clearance then I froze in awe. It seemed to come so fast, which is amazing considering most emergency services dispatchers could be professional auctioneers and I can still understand them. All I could say was "uhh... SWA8351... say again, a little slower this time please". After that everything went smoothly until I was transferred to UNICOM from KZLA, for you see I never heard the handoff. So here I am about 30NM out of SFO with nothing coming my way. I sent a PM to KZLA who says they cleared me for freq. change a while ago Now I'm only 20 out of SFO. I more or less dive bombed the poor guy in SFO's tower. He sounded a little shocked when I requested clearance to land for 28R at 12,000 when only 4 miles out. Needless to say when I was halfway through the localizer and still at 6,000, I decided it would be a good idea to go missed approach. After that I fixed myself and made a nice landing. After the flight I realized I forgot to write 'Newbie' in the remarks box along with 'Testing Hardware' (yay finally tuned this thing just right) and 'No SID/STARs please'... To the gentlemen at LAX tower, SoCal Departure, LA Center, and SFO tower: Thank you for putting up with me and making the process as smooth as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbie Nauffts 1045788 Posted November 9, 2009 at 03:33 AM Posted November 9, 2009 at 03:33 AM Ahhh, the first time into Daunting LAX. I was stupid enough to go into LAX with a wingman from a VSOA with two Hornets. We were on short final when a 747 looked like it was over the hold short line and both of us went missed and into the standard military "battlebreak". Both bugs accelerated to 250 kts, and at the departure end of the runway wrenched into 4g turns and set up downwind for landing. Unicom went nuts and the controller on the tower said "Very nice guys, but next time fly the missed please." http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rAaY8poAF74 “Aviation is not inherently dangerous, but it is terribly unforgiving.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Wilks Posted November 20, 2009 at 03:10 AM Posted November 20, 2009 at 03:10 AM Many thanks to Charan and Alex for your comments in early October regarding some problems I was having in understanding what had happened in one of my flights. I'm sorry I've been delayed in coming back to you but my flightsimming has been reduced in the last month or so as my family visited me from England for a couple of weeks at the end of October and just after they left, the wife put her back out and I had to wear my doctor's outfit for a while instead of my pilot's uniform. It was strange but, in just a few weeks away from regular flying, quite a few areas of my knowledge and understanding had started to unravel and I found myself struggling to feel comfortable about many of the procedures I thought I'd got solidly under my belt. So, I went back to my reading and flying offline for a while before coming back and trying a few simple VFR flights on VATSIM. The other night I fairly successfully completed a flight from Venice to Fort Myers where Lloyd Boyette was on tower duties. Despite misjudging my approach and having to join the traffic pattern on base rather than downwind (sorry Lloyd), I was again feeling moderately comfortable with what I was doing - particularly when I managed, with Lloyd's [Mod - Happy Thoughts]istance, to avoid a conflict with another aircraft taxiing out from the ramp as I was taxiing in. So, I'm thinking that I'm back to where I was so I'll once again be making a nuisance of myself all over the skies of central Florida! Charan - I understand your point about the benefits of flight following and I'll now request that service (as long as Centre can accommodate it) when on VFR flights. After all, as you say, it's the contact with live ATC that distinguishes flying on VATSIM from flying offline. Alex - I'm sure you're correct and that I was probably reading a little too much into ATC's comments about Whitted being uncontrolled and their 'instruction' to remain clear of controlled airspace. I'll still post a message on Miami's forums to see if anyone can clarify a few queries I have regarding coverage at Cl[Mod - Happy Thoughts] Delta airports - although I'm starting to get a little worried that I'm perhaps trying to do too much learning before flying rather than leaving some of the learning process to take place during flights. And when departing VFR, although I'll now anticipate a standard instruction to remain clear of controlled airspace, I'll interpret that along the lines you suggest - ie that I should remain clear until I ask for and receive a separate clearance (for Bravo airspace) or establish two-way radio contact (for Charlie airspace). Once again, many thanks gents and I hope to meet you soon either in the skies or over the radio. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Aldrich 1132505 Posted November 27, 2009 at 04:38 AM Posted November 27, 2009 at 04:38 AM My first VATSIM flight was uneventful as there was nobody around. In fact in the handful of flights I've made so far, I've seen only one other aircraft. Each time I planned a flight into an active ARTCC, the controller would disconnect before I got there. It worked out for the best since it gave me time to get used to filing flight plans and using SB. Tonight I ran into a controller for the first time and I messed it up right from the start. I was in contact with MSP_CTR (I was N7551G) and the transmissions kept breaking up on my end, then I froze and instantly forgot instructions before I could write them down, had to ask the controller to repeat multiple times... Finally just gave up and disconnected. So, my apologies to MSP_CTR. I prepared as best as I could, but I guess I need more practice. You've been flying too much when you: Refer to your spouse as Clearance/Delivery, file a flight plan to go to the corner store, when on the phone you read back everything other people say... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Williams 877539 Posted November 28, 2009 at 05:04 AM Posted November 28, 2009 at 05:04 AM Each time I planned a flight into an active ARTCC, the controller would disconnect before I got there. Tim, Best thing to do is look at how long the controller has been online. If he's been online 2 hours or more, chances are he'll be leaving soon. Look for controllers that have been online less than an hour, and your chances of having them there for your flight are much greater. Wade Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanner Novak 1098567 Posted November 28, 2009 at 05:22 AM Posted November 28, 2009 at 05:22 AM Each time I planned a flight into an active ARTCC, the controller would disconnect before I got there. Tim, Best thing to do is look at how long the controller has been online. If he's been online 2 hours or more, chances are he'll be leaving soon. Look for controllers that have been online less than an hour, and your chances of having them there for your flight are much greater. Wade Might I add, try downloading VAT-Spy. It has a map that shows you where controllers are online and all online traffic. I've found it to be a HUGE help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom van der elst Posted November 28, 2009 at 05:49 AM Posted November 28, 2009 at 05:49 AM My first VATSIM flight was uneventful as there was nobody around. In fact in the handful of flights I've made so far, I've seen only one other aircraft. Each time I planned a flight into an active ARTCC, the controller would disconnect before I got there. It worked out for the best since it gave me time to get used to filing flight plans and using SB. Tonight I ran into a controller for the first time and I messed it up right from the start. I was in contact with MSP_CTR (I was N7551G) and the transmissions kept breaking up on my end, then I froze and instantly forgot instructions before I could write them down, had to ask the controller to repeat multiple times... Finally just gave up and disconnected. So, my apologies to MSP_CTR. I prepared as best as I could, but I guess I need more practice. dude, don't disconnect,why did you do that? now you will be even more nervous to connect and talk again. just sit through man,it''ll get better,éven I got to talk on the radio, and I can't talk normal on a phone,and still cannot believe I cán talk to some atc dude far away from me that I do not know. I can pretty much handle it,even if I do oc[Mod - Happy Thoughts]ionally forget my callsign at the end of a transmission,or the right way to say things. it doesn't matter,I'm really trying hard to do it right, and so are you,so just stick with it and go fór it, as nothing's as nice as parking your plane at the end of an atc filled flight! come on,man,log in,try again,put newbie in your flighplan remarks,and let atc help you out,they're not monsters! (well,that's what I believe,then again,I've never seen 'm so maybe they are.) Tom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Aldrich 1132505 Posted November 28, 2009 at 02:13 PM Posted November 28, 2009 at 02:13 PM Wade & Tanner, I've been using servinfo to see who is on and where, but have never really noticed how long people have been on. I'll check that info from now on. Tom, The next night I parked my butt at an airport near KDFW and did some more listening and copying. Caught CYYZ tower on this morning and flew out of there. He was very accommodating and patient with me. I had a few problems, but it went much better than the my panic attack with MSP. You've been flying too much when you: Refer to your spouse as Clearance/Delivery, file a flight plan to go to the corner store, when on the phone you read back everything other people say... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom van der elst Posted November 28, 2009 at 02:25 PM Posted November 28, 2009 at 02:25 PM Wade & Tanner, I've been using servinfo to see who is on and where, but have never really noticed how long people have been on. I'll check that info from now on. Tom, The next night I parked my butt at an airport near KDFW and did some more listening and copying. Caught CYYZ tower on this morning and flew out of there. He was very accommodating and patient with me. I had a few problems, but it went much better than the my panic attack with MSP. Good for you and well done for doing that you scared me with your sudden disconnect story !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yosef AlBatal 1078160 Posted November 28, 2009 at 05:10 PM Posted November 28, 2009 at 05:10 PM Well, I just stumbled on this thread, read some of the posts, loved them, and had good laughs, so here goes my story which started on the 22nd of October, 2008. I’ve been simming since FS2000, aviation is my p[Mod - Happy Thoughts]ion, and before joining VATSIM I was already an advanced simmer with knowledge with FMC, SIDs, STARs, aircraft systems, etc, and I only fly the most relatively advanced aircraft out there. I’ve always seen the words VATSIM and IVAO all over, but was never interested, until I was introduced to VATSIM by a new friend. I registered, read the PRC, got SB, read its manual, got VATspy, and my first flight was an event between Cairo and Abu Simbel, I was advised to sit on the ground and listen to see how it works, and that’s why I spent most of the event on the ground. When I logged in, I couldn’t see DEL, GND, etc, only saw CTR, so I am like, okay, that’s the guy I’ll contact when I am airborne, but I felt it wouldn’t be right, so I went ahead prepared my aircraft, and a voice inside me tells me just let the guy know what you are doing, so I’m like KLM334 pushing back. And I get “you are not cleared for push back”. I had a lousy laptop back then with a built-in mic near the keyboard that wasn’t working, and I used to get I hear you zero by five. So I spent a lot of time on the ground radio checking, until I found the solution, lean forward on the keyboard and scream whenever I want to say something, and the controller would barely hear me but it worked (it was hard to write down instructions with your face in the keyboard ), I didn’t like the text thing and still don’t, but after that I got a nice complete headset and now a new laptop with a great mic. The next few days I wanted to make a smooth flight, and the staffed airports I’d always see were KLAX and KLAS, so I am like what the hell, I learnt a lot from flying there, but didn't give any a trouble :O, and my highlight of my VATSIM hours was when I made a flight into EGLL during a rush hour, and then I knew I was doing well enough, and as they say, the rest is history. I still fly with the same call-sign I started with, all over the globe, I participate in as many events as my time allows, I started my controller training, currently I am a STU+ and the events coordinator of VATEG :O The controller that day is the current VATEG director. And when I once brought it up to him, he was shocked it was me that day, apparently he still remembers what I did. I am proud to be part of this professional network full of very friendly and helpful members, and as a controller, I do my best to help out newbies, but the fact is most of them I see in Cairo really don’t want to help themselves (lazy readers), I had to wallop a very few of them. What I’d love to see is a new website for VATSIM with many statistical and coordination tools, and a kind of standard format sites for the vACCs under VATSIM.net for easier flying around the globe. And I’d have to say, I learnt a lot from VATSIM as a pilot and controller, and it is still very fun. Thank you all for making it happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Cowley 1035725 Posted December 24, 2009 at 06:50 PM Posted December 24, 2009 at 06:50 PM I am still so shy that I can't use voice comms as I'm worried I'll mess it up big-time! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yosef AlBatal 1078160 Posted December 24, 2009 at 07:11 PM Posted December 24, 2009 at 07:11 PM Speak slowly at first, you will get the speed in no time, it's worth it!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom van der elst Posted December 24, 2009 at 08:00 PM Posted December 24, 2009 at 08:00 PM I am still so shy that I can't use voice comms as I'm worried I'll mess it up big-time! It took me 7 !! years to start flying the /v tag,and let me tell you : it ain't worth it. get yourself a headset,learn the flying talk,then start talking with the rest of us. It is so incredibly rewarding to fly a flight with atc all the way and never have to type anything. I can't believe I haven't done it earlier,it is thát great. Go for it man,you are really missing out on something really great, and you don't háve to miss out. Tom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johan Grauers Posted December 25, 2009 at 01:30 AM Posted December 25, 2009 at 01:30 AM Don't worry Yosef, ATC don't bite (at least I don't ). It's difficullt at first, but 1. we all make misstakes, even the most experienced pilots and atc sometimes go "eerhm, disregard" on the frequency. So don't worry, nobody will be mad at your for making an error. 2. It really helps if you know what's comming, I'm a new swedish controller and during my training I got set templates to use. This means that if you go to my airport and listen in you will hear me using almost identical phrases, so when you call up you can be ripeady for what to expect. So my tip is to sit and listen in, that way you know what's comming. 3. Have a paper and pencil next to you, on the top you put your callsign in BIG letters. Then beneath it you can put what ever you need. Let's try to demonstrate with an example First I have my paper, at the top I put my callsing wich I right now decided is SAS152. Then beneath it I write: stand 12, Boeing 737, info Lima, QNH1010. This is because when I call for clearence this (and my destination) is what the atc might want" from me. So when I call up I can simply look at my paper and go "landvetter tower good evening, sas152, stand 12, type boeing 737, request clearence to stockholm arlanda. Information LIma onboard, QNH 1010." And because I already know what's coming I've prepared the next line with _________ departure squawk And I also know the standard reply, so when the controller replies I'm ready "SAS152, start-up approved, cleared to stockholm arlanda via Laban2J departure, squawk 6071" So now I fill in the blanks so my paper shows Laban2J departure, squawk 6071. Then it's read back "Cleared to arlanda via Laban2J departure, squawk 6071, scandinavian152." The answer you want then is "SAS152, read-back correct". Then it keeps on going, I keep my paper ready for the arrival STAR, any vectors or anything at all really. My point here is that even though it seems overwhelming at first voice communication does have a very defined pattern. Once you learn it you'll be able to communicate like a pro in no-time. And also, nobody will bite you or be mad because you make an error. On the countrary, don't be afraid to put newbie in the remarks section of your flight plan. I will just be glad you let me know so I can be prepared to help you out if needed. But don't be afraid, because voice comm is great! And like Tom said, there's nothing like flying an entire flight with full atc! Johan Grauers Event Coordinator - vACC Scandinavia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yosef AlBatal 1078160 Posted December 25, 2009 at 01:49 AM Posted December 25, 2009 at 01:49 AM I guess it's meant for Captain/James Cowley, great post, cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yosef AlBatal 1078160 Posted December 25, 2009 at 02:08 AM Posted December 25, 2009 at 02:08 AM ATC don't bite (at least I don't ). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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