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Thanks Rahul/Marc

 

So its a simple test that should make the new member look for the answers if he/she already doesnt know them.

 

Then once the ARTCC is chosen, the member then goes on to start training for the S1 grade and GND ops.

 

Smashing idea

David James

VATSIM Screenshot Contest Coordinator

Intel Core 2 Quad CPU Q6600 2.4gig, RAM 3.25gig, ATI Radeon HD4800, XP Pro SP3, FS9.1 FSnav FSinn VRC

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has nothing to do with GRP as far as i know, could be wrong, but its only done to filter the folks who arent really serious from clogging up the training.

 

its worked pretty well if you try to compare with when these places had open door policies, which completely clogged up the system. if you think the lines at Disney World are long, the lines for training were a joke here.

 

think Gary or some of the others can provide numbers for comparison

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Well I suggest a remake of your training system, GRP2 doesn't allow for a Pre Controller test.

 

These are the things I find clog your system

 

Running [Mod - Happy Thoughts]essments with _I_ on the vatsim server, instead of using a simulator file in Tower trainer on Sweatbox, if your session on VATSIM with _I_ and it does not achieve the right amount of traffic your students have to sit it again, this is clogging your system it creates more work for the training department, where as in the simulator you can script it to the GRP competency's, and make it a fair [Mod - Happy Thoughts]essment because every one does the same [Mod - Happy Thoughts]essment, also removing the _I_ and _M_ sessions from the VATSIM network open up these positions for people that are rated to operate which interns bumps up their hours, which allows them to move up through the ratings, and become /I or /M.

 

It is not mandatory to start your students at S1, removing this step will remove workload from your [Mod - Happy Thoughts]essors and mentors, you can start people at S2 on your smaller towers, then work them into GND at the majors when they are ready.

 

Sweatbox is sterile, you can pause it to discuss with the candidate things that you need to talk about, you cant do that on VATSIM.

Every one does the same [Mod - Happy Thoughts]essment.

Kirk Christie - VATPAC C3

VATPAC Undercover ATC Agent

Worldflight Perth 737-800 Crew Member

956763

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I prefer to do OTS' on the live network because I have come across, and been guilty myself, of hinting at the appropriateness of handling a situation in my calls whereas on the live network they have to deal with the pilots who can successfully track bearings on NDBs to the pilots who can't fly a STAR and put in remarks "Please give vectors for the STAR" and then can't do an ILS or Visual approach without hitting other aircraft. The simulated versus real environment can be, and usually are, extremely different..

 

Lastly, where does the GRP2 specifically prohibit pre-training testing. I know of many places who give a simple test to ensure the student has done some studying on their own so they don't clog the training system to be hand held through the same written information they should've been reading since day 1. IE, hand holding through S1 can take 12 hours of training, with 15-20 being the average. Whereas if they read the information you can do 1 hour of check, then the rest can be fine tuning.

 

The best way to unclog training: Make sure your students study BEFORE scheduling a training session.

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I was under the impression that all rating [Mod - Happy Thoughts]essments for a GRP2 grade must be performed on the live network, although at the moment I cannot find reference to this in the GRP itself.

 

On occasion, it may take up to three months for a rating to be awarded mainly due to not having enough traffic for the examiner to be satisfied that the candidate meets all of the requirements.

 

In the UK for example, for the STU3 APP Rating [Mod - Happy Thoughts]essment, the candidate must control a minimum of seven aircraft, preferably ten aircraft, simultaneously in the sector.

 

On occasion, the [Mod - Happy Thoughts]essment can wait at least a month before a second sitting is picked up by an examiner due to the first sitting not having enough traffic to meet this criteria.

David James

VATSIM Screenshot Contest Coordinator

Intel Core 2 Quad CPU Q6600 2.4gig, RAM 3.25gig, ATI Radeon HD4800, XP Pro SP3, FS9.1 FSnav FSinn VRC

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Dave, thats what sweatbox is for, you can infact use sweatbox for OTS's. its very common in areas that dont get as much traffic, like in Thailand where we may get a dozen aircraft or so a week.

 

if its taking people 3 MONTHS to get a single rating because of a lack of traffic, thats a failure on the part of the trainer for not using the tools available to them. if we did that in thailand itd take years

 

if an examiner is worried about the student meeting their criteria, hit it up in sweatbox, you can throw the exact situations you want at the student so you can be sure they know how to do it, instead of waiting for a pilot to do it.

 

Kirk, youll definitely want to point where you are reading that entrance exams arent allowed its not in the GRP at all, not 3.2, not section 5 under local rules. again, nothing to do with GRP as this is done as a filter, it does not go towards any rating. check out the test yourself, youll see exactly whats on there

 

havent folks been calling for pilot entrance exams? this is the ATC version of that

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Exactly Ernesto. My ARTCC uses them to see if the controller has looked over the material and weed out those that are serious about those and those that aren't. Was in place before I got there and I have no intentions on changing that. I don't have the staff to spend countless sessions getting a controller to learn the same thing they could from the training material.

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There is no "one size fits all" training and [Mod - Happy Thoughts]essment method since each training delivery facility must manage its own training resources and training staff to best suit local needs and requirements.

 

However; GRP2 part 3.2 contains the following requirements for ATC tests and [Mod - Happy Thoughts]essments:

  • A. The tests/[Mod - Happy Thoughts]essments for each rating level MUST include both a theory test and a practical [Mod - Happy Thoughts]essment.
    B. A satisfactory p[Mod - Happy Thoughts] with a minimum score of 80% in the theory test shall be a prerequisite to sitting the [Mod - Happy Thoughts]ociated practical [Mod - Happy Thoughts]essment
    C. Where preferred the tests/[Mod - Happy Thoughts]essments for Ground Controller (S1) AND Tower Controller (S2) may be optionally combined to form a single [Mod - Happy Thoughts]essment for Tower Controller (S2). When combined the tests/[Mod - Happy Thoughts]essments must cover ALL competencies for BOTH ratings
    D. Training and [Mod - Happy Thoughts]essment methods must be of efficient design in order to minimize delays; particularly for those seeking to become a new controller.

 

In respect of part D; the most efficient way to deliver the written test is through on-line questions and automated scoring. GRP2 parts 3.2 A and 3.2 B establish the written test as a filter before having a trainee engage in further components that become time-consuming and resource intensive.

 

Incidentally, the NEW Training & [Mod - Happy Thoughts]essment Methods discussion forum from the GRP Review is currently under way. All VATSIM divisions and training departments are engaged in a discussion in relation to all aspects of ATC training and [Mod - Happy Thoughts]essment.

 

Roland Collins

VP Regions

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The discussion forum is for all those actually involved in the design and delivery of training and [Mod - Happy Thoughts]essment; those making decisions about this within their own realm. In many cases this is under division control however; this appies to some vACCs and they have been included where requested by their division.

 

Roland Collins

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  • 2 months later...
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Question: How long does it typically take to get started in your training? I p[Mod - Happy Thoughts]ed the SOP exam a week ago, received the obviously standard form letter email ("Welcome to the Memphis virtual Air Route Traffic Control Center...Training will take some time to achieve; however, you should receive a second packet very soon") and have never heard from anyone within that organization since.

 

Should I continue to be patient or consider something different?

 

Don

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First of all, welcome to the ATC team!

 

In my opinion, being patient for 3-5 days is smart and prudent. After that your best course of action is to:

1. Reread your welcome letter, and make sure you've complied with any directions that are in the letter, and if you have,

2. Contact the staff at Memphis. The Memphis Training Administrator, Garen Evans, may be reached at [email protected], and the Air Traffic Manager, Mark Hubbert, may be reached at [email protected]

 

 

Don Desfosse

Air Traffic Manager

Boston ARTCC

Don Desfosse
Vice President, Membership

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  • 1 month later...

Hey there Don,

 

Don made some great points... *Don and Don... This post is going to get real confusing real soon.*

 

I'm not sure why you didn't get the second email but your next step would be to sign up on the vZME website, I haven't seen an application by you but if you have done so, let me know and I'll go and make sure someone didn't hit the wrong button. -> http://www.vzmeartcc.org/join.php Once you have done that the team will approve it and you will be pointed in the right direction regarding your training

 

Cheers!

Rahul

vZME FE

Rahul Parkar

"On second thoughts Nappa, catch it, catch it with your teeth" -- Vegeta

Professional Nerd. (Professionally not professional)

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  • 3 weeks later...

Not including bias , they are all great choices, and all of them would love you to join

 

Cheers

Rahul

Rahul Parkar

"On second thoughts Nappa, catch it, catch it with your teeth" -- Vegeta

Professional Nerd. (Professionally not professional)

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